Joao

Joao

Oral history from Brazil to Lawrence, Kansas.

Joao is from Bahia, Brazil. In Brazil, he took night classes from a local college while working full-time at a company. During this time, Joao also started to take English lessons. He arrived in the U.S. and took business classes at Pittsburg State University in order to advance his career. Joao reflects on his scholarly experience which would not have been the same without support from the University of Kansas’ Center for Latin American and Caribbean Studies.

2001

Lawrence, Kansas

Joao (J)
Marta (M)

J: With my savings in everything that I got, after I left my company, I had less than $100 in my pocket. That's how I got to the United States.

J: And I got the job in Maine, way up north. So I was so that's that's how I got here. And then I say is speaking very, very little English and with no money in my pocket.

J: I remember my first job was at a ski resort and the job was to work as a ski lift operator. So it'd be outdoors all the time. And I had to work overtime so I couldn't make more money.

J: And there was really hard because I didn't have money to buy the right boots, so I bought like a $20 pair of boots from Walmart. And I remember like it was really cold. It was difficult in the beginning.

J: And I remember talking to my supervisor. They're asking for a different job at the ski resort and that I could do anything.

J: So they put me to work as a housekeeper.

J: And I remember I was the only happy housekeeper at the ski resort [unknwon] always complain about it. I would say no, this is really good. I get to be indoors all the time, so I was very happy about it.

J: And so while I was there [in Maine], my university in Brazil had an exchange agreement with Pittsburg State University here in Kansas–Pitt State, it's about two hours from Lawrence. And…but in order to be able to participate in this exchange agreement, I had to pass the TOEFL test and my English skills were very limited.

J: So my idea, my plan after I left Brazil was I'm going to work at a ski resort, learn English as much as I can, and then see if after April I can move to Kansas and start school in August…in Kansas.

J: This is the idea. I could not go directly to Pitt State because I didn't speak English.

J: So my idea is, okay, I'm gonna do these, save as much money as I can, work in Maine and then move to Kansas.

J: But I mean, I mean, all the plans were very I mean, I had no idea if things would work out just like a big plan.

J: And actually then I worked in Maine and worked overtime. I remember I had two or three different jobs at once and worked weekends and didn't take days off. And I was able I remember like leaving Maine with about $3,000 in my pocket and move into Kansas.

J: When I got there to Pitt State, I–I thought my English wasn't good enough to take the TOEFL so I took one last English class. They have this English–Teaching English program at the university that costs like $2,000 for one module, so I did one month.

J: But in my case, I had to take to do like two modules and they just had money from one. So I said “Okay, I'm gonna do one and take the TOEFL.” If you're taking the TOEFL, don't need to do the other one. And that's what happened.

J: Then I didn't have time to study for the TOEFL and because I had to work also at that time, I had an on-campus job and off-campus job. And I so I've been all like all those lay–low paid labor positions. I’ve been a dishwasher, a housekeeper, I delivered pizza. I made burritos.

J: I've had more than 20 different jobs in the US and neither have I remember going to get an appointment for the TOEFL. And they told me and then my plan was to take from one month from that day just to get these [unknown] do some kind of steady, and even though I have very little time because I was working a lot.

J: And they told me know, if you want to take the TOEFL and you want to get the results by August to be able to enroll as a PSU student next semester, you need to take it today.

J: And I remember going back home getting my checkbook because I had to pay. And that's how I took the TOEFL without…

J: I just–I remember just sitting in front of the computer. That's how I took the exam and say, “Okay, whatever happens now.” And so I took it and then I think it was like two weeks later–at that time, like how this process was slower. I think nowadays you'll get the results fastest, faster…

J: And I remember, I even asked the Secretary of the International Office at Pitt State to call and make sure that she got to the score numbers right because I was afraid they would misunderstand anything.

J: And she called the TOEFL and she told me I had passed but very barely I remember the minimum score was 190. And I got 194, like maybe one or two questions that made the difference and I couldn't believe it. I couldn’t believe that I passed it. And so that's then from there, I was able to enroll in school and business classes and be a full-time student at PSU without having to pay tuition.

M: Okay. Let me ask a couple of factual questions here. I'm taking notes as I go.

M: How old were you and what age were you when you first came to the US and went to Maine?

J: I was 21 or 22. I know that I was at least 21 because I could drink. And I remember that that was one of the cultural differences. That you had to be 21 to drink, to go to a bar and drink; in Brazil I had been doing that since I was 16.

M: Wait a minute. So what year was this?

J: I think it was 2001–was the first time I got here. 2001. Because I'm 40. Yeah, I was twenty two. 21. 22.

M: Okay. Where in Brazil did you come from?

J: From the south. Rio Grande du Sol. It's–the hometown is Bagé.

M: Okay.

J: This is like 30 miles from Uruguay, right on the border.

M: Okay. When you went to Pitt State, what program were you enrolled in? Was it a grad program or an undergrad program?

J: Undergrad. Undergrad. Business. Because this is something that I–for me, business was a choice because when I lived in Brazil, the easiest way to get a job was pretty much work in business. I wasn't that I was very, very interested in business, ended up doing business later in my life and I even had my own company. But I never really liked to study business and to read a business book to this day for me, it's one of the most boring things in the world but that way it was more like a survival thing than anything else, wasn't that I was really passionate about business.

M: Okay. Go ahead.

J: So then I became an exchange student at PSU. At that time I didn't have to pay tuition because of the exchange agreement with my Brazilian university.

J: And then I got a job on campus, working 20 hours a week.

J: And then in my second, second semester. So as I was living in the cheapest place on campus because I didn't, I didn't, I didn't have credit card, I didn't have money from my family, anything. I had to live just by the 20 hours at minimum wage that I worked on campus.

J: And then one day I remember we–I learned about the host family program that they had. And so I went to the library to find out about [what] the host family program was and they told me that you had the opportunity to have a local family. They are to take you and on the weekends to places and do stuff like that.

J: And I asked them, “Don't you guys have something that you have, you can live with the family?” and be like I, because I thought it would be a good way to learn English, to improve my English. And the lady that organized the program told me “No, but let me know, but let me see if I can find something for you.”

J: And then two weeks later, she told me to come work at the at the library at Pitt State, she was a librarian and she told me, “Come, come here and talk to my boss; he's been to Paraguay many times.”

J: He was the Dean of learning resources, which includes the library. He was in charge for the library at Pitt State. And he might be interested in taking you as, as his guest in his place but he wants to talk to you first to see if you are not like the regular college student that just wants to party.

J: So then I went and I talked to him and he became my second father. To this day.

J: And he actually invited my brother. I have a younger brother to come to United States and even paid tuition for my brother–he became..he is family, now–he’s family. And he became one of the most important people in my life.

J: And it was funny how things happen like to be. I never imagined that it would be in Kansas and I’ll have like almost like a second father to me. And he helped me a lot, helped my family helped my brother. And to this day we hear my son calls him Grampa Bob because he comes home because he still lives that Pittsburgh.

J: And that's the end finishing day. And I was able to extend the exchange agreement from two semesters to the whole thing, I was able to graduate Pitt State, which was excellent for me because I didn't have to be we shouldn't. I was able to finish getting a degree from here from the United States was something that I never imagined when I lived in Brazil.

J: Because when that left Brazil, I only had the guarantee that had this three months work, working at the ski resort. Everything from there was just like things that couldn't happen until things turn out much better than I initially thought from Brazil.

J: And then from there, there's a long story. Then from there I ended up, I started my MBA, there at the same university after I finished my BA–

M: –Even though you hated business?

J: Well, it's just convenient at that time. I wasn't really big. I mean, nowadays I'm, I think I'm a good student. I wasn't like that at that time. Like that's for me, school was much more a way to advance my career, to get a diploma. And I wasn't really big in education at that time for me or as much more, get a job, make money. This was important for me at that time.

J: When I started, I did one semester of the MBA. And during the summer, I went to Thailand as an exchange student from PSU. And I am supposed to stay three months in Thailand and then go back to the US. I ended up loving Thailand and I stayed two years there.

J: And so I stayed at least two years in Bangkok. I lived briefly in Poland, in Warsaw. And then, and then I went into Chile.

J: In Chile, I met my wife and we lived in Chile for five years. And my wife is from the north of Brazil, is from the, from Pará, which if you look at Brazil map is the two extremes. Way up. Now if I'm way down south, we ended up living five years in Chile, and went back to Brazil.

J: And so I'm jumping a lot here because I want to explain how I got back. In Chile. I had my own company. I actually made very good money or while working in the company.

J: And then I had a family situation also, if then that made me had have to return to Brazil. And then in Brazil I was working in business. And one day, I was invited to give a talk at a local university about my international experience. I should talk about the student knows how I had gone to the United States.

J: So in Thailand, I worked as a teacher because that was the easiest way to get a job in Bangkok. Pretty much if you are white, have round eyes and you have a diploma from the United States, you can teach.

J: And I was teaching at a university that I was way under-qualified for just because of my physical appearance, I got the job. So I ended up leaving. That's how I got into teaching or just because it was a necessity, that was the only job that I pretty much that could get in Bangkok.

J: And then I went, when I went to this local university to give this talk about my international experience, I went back home and told my wife I need to go back to school. That's why I ended up loving teaching in Thailand. And I'm not really happy.

J: I don't care that much about the money situation as long as I have enough to pay my bills.

J: And then I got back home and told my wife about that: I'm thinking about applying for a master's program in US. And she was very supportive. And she told me, “Yeah, If you think this is the best thing for you.” And she liked the idea of moving here to United States, so I contact…

J: In Thailand. I had thought about doing a master's degree and I had contacted Professor Brent Metz, who at that time was working at the Center for Latin American and Caribbean Studies. But I think he was the assistance that assistance of Professor [Elizabeth] Kuznesof at that time or something like that. He was working. And I remember he told me at that time that they could not give me a scholarship because they didn't have enough money, but they would take me as a student in the master's program. And for me that was not a viable solution because I couldn't pay tuition.

J: Then. So I got back home like 15 years like more than ten years later after that email that had sent to print maps. And say, oh, maybe I have it still have the contact of the guy from KU. I'm going to email him asking about masters for any opportunities in Kansas, but had no idea if you worked at KU, if what he was doing. I just got his email address, my email account, and I sent Brent in an email. There was in 2000…2016. Yeah. Oh, I see. Around like I am thinking about getting a master's degree, but I felt like maybe in two years from that time I could save money and come to the United States. And I usually around like I really would like to get a master's degree in Latin American Studies.

J: And he–I didn't expect he would write me back–and he did like right away and say, oh, actually I am the director because he, Professor [Unknown] was on leave. That's a massive and he he took over as the director for that semester. The center. I'm actually the director at the Center, and I'd love to have you here as a student. Then things got serious from there. And then he told me that he they had only one scholarship at the center.

J: That time was I think Joe was the TA at a time. So he tried to get me funding through the Spanish program. As I spoke Spanish. I couldn't teach Portuguese because Portuguese, there isn't a lot of demand for Portuguese classes and they couldn't hire it, a Portuguese instructor. So that's how I got here. They got me a scholarship to teach Spanish for the first year and that's how I got here.

J: I had been here just once before because KU use to host a Brazilian carnival. And while I was at Pitt State, I came to visit here, the campus. And I just had this idea, told my wife that place is really beautiful. I remember walking on campus and walking on Mass[achusetts] Street and say, like, I just had this feeling, that place is really cool. I think if we leave there, we're going to like it. But I didn't I mean, I was I came here just to party that weekend. So I didn't have any concrete plans. I just I just had the feeling. I left Lawrence with the feeling that place is really cool, is beautiful, the campus is beautiful and the university is very good.

J: And that's all I got here.

J: It was in 2000…2016…yeah, 2016. I applied for it in 2015. Got here in 2016. And my wife was pregnant. She was five months? Yeah. Yeah. About five months into the pregnancy when we got here. So we are very concerned about this situation because we didn't know about the hospital situation. I always heard and felt also the experience of having to go to a hospital here and getting these huge bill for something that was very basic.

J: I remember when I was at Pitt State, I hurt my arm and I fell off my bike school and I remember getting these $500 bill. So I was like, I don't know what this is going to cost to deliver a baby here, but..

J: So we came here with this very excited but very concerned at the same time with the things turned out to be way better than we expected at the hospital and the health insurance and everything.

J: Everything worked out fine.

J: And so I did the first, when I got, my idea was to do an interdisciplinary master's program because at that time I wasn't really sure what my discipline was. I just knew it was something in the humanities.

J: That's the only thing that I knew.

J: But I didn't really know to be history. And so I took classes for a semester, some classes from Portuguese and Spanish department and two classes, a history class with Professor Kuznesof.

J: And after that semester for me, it was 100% clear. That's what I want to do: history, that's my field and Professor Kuznesof, of course, became my advisor and I mean, I–I don't have words to thank her for everything that she's done for me here.

J: And it's on that and say, okay, so I took the, the end after my first year teaching Spanish. Professor Sontiago was in the transition to leave and you're taking over the department she had before she left? I think she had made arrangements for me to become the TA for the center.

J: And I remember that my third semester I would take over Professor [Robert] Schwaller’s class, which was a challenge.

J: I've been always open to take up challenges here they say, Oh, well I teach another class, you know this better than anyone and say, Okay, yes.

J: I believe in preparation. If you prepare yourself, you can do it. That's the way I saw it: it would be a good challenge.

J: And so after of the day, I had the best, the best experience here.

J: And then from there it was obvious that I was going to continue my studies. I didn't want to stop at the master's degree. And I applied to the PhD program in history.

J: At that point, I know 100% history is my discipline and so I’ve been here [Lawrence, KS] and now it's been five years. My son is four now.

J: Now we are in the process of moving to Virginia and we already think about how much you're going to miss Lawrence because if you have had the best years of my life, I'd say I think it's four or five years here, that's been excellent.

Marta Caminero-Santangelo

Joao

English

Video

Bahia, Brazil

Lawrence, Kansas

Pittsburg, Kansas