1 10 49 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Language of Interview English Format Video, audio only, text only Video Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Aron Muci City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Nicaragua Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Wichita, Kansas Intermediate point in journey (1) City/State or Country to which interviewee (or parents/grandparents) traveled before coming to current point of residence Los Angeles, California Transcript Abel (A): Aron (M): A: When I think of stories that sort of attached myself to my identity, I think a lot of our celebrations, I think one of the things that I like about my parents is that they always, even though we live in the United States, were born here, and you know they immigrated here, I think that they still taught us and embrace their culture from Nicaragua. A: And they taught us a lot about the cultural beliefs and celebrations and the way that a lot of people from Nicaragua, the food, the music, was always something that they shared with us. And I think that always helped us, at least for me, at least identify with that. A: And I've always had a huge pride in that. I know that for, especially a lot of people in the United States, it's very typical to when you assume you look at a person that looks hispanic or whatever, a lot of people assume that they're from Mexico because a large portion of them are usually Mexican. A: And I remember always being a little kid and when people would say that, I would always correct them and say “No, I'm Nicaragua and my parents are from Nicaragua. A: And that was always instinctual to me because I wanted to ensure that no different, my culture is different from what people will assume it to be. I think I've always had that identity and I think that it comes from my parents, you know, through the, we call it the purisima, which is a very important celebration in December. A: It stretches from the end of November to December 7th. I think that for Nicaragua it's a celebration of the Virgin Mary. And for Nicaragua, the Virgin Mary of Nicaragua is the Virgin of the Immaculate Conception. And so it's a very huge celebration. A: And so every day along that week, seven to nine days span. Every night, we have certain prayers and songs that we did. And some of my earliest memories are always going to be me and my sisters and my parents all doing this every day. Singing the songs, being the prayer, being together and being collected. A: It so happens that my birthday falls on what they refer to as the Gritería, which is kind of when the whole country as a whole goes out and celebrates it together so people can have stalls and a lot of people will have their own kind of altars and stuff dedicated to the Virgin Mary. And people can come along, they go out, they saying they're singing all the songs that were specially created for celebration and they go out. There's, It's basically like a huge party in the streets. A: And the way my parents always describe it as just a beautiful moment where everybody is connected and together. I think for me, having my birthday fall on a very special day, my mom always said that it's one of the greatest gifts. And I think for me that's always sort of attached myself to my culture. And I think that that's a huge thing for me when I think of, you know, part of my identity in that sense, as a Nicaraguan. A: And I think that, I think about that a lot in terms of other ways of how I identify, I think that as a person in the Midwest, they think that, you know, I think benefiting from living in Wichita, which is one of the most populated cities in terms of the Latino population, I think that that has certainly helped because you certainly see a lot more than I know, like a lot of other places in Kansas. I know a lot of other people who don't see that many [Latinos]. And so you're just surrounded with a lot more traditional white Caucasian people. A: But I was lucky enough to see a lot more of those people. And I think that it definitely helps because you feel like you're not as alone or isolated. And so I think that that helps a lot. As a first generation immigrant, I guess I didn't really realize the weight of that… really until a lot later. A: So when I got older and I really started to see, like, the significance, I think for me, you know, talking with my parents, I realize a lot of the things as I'm getting older, the things that they did when I, when I, when they were my age. And seeing the parallels of how our lives are very different. And how when they were in high school growing up, stories of them trying to go to college and that stuff, how they studied. All those different things are stories that they shared with us as motivation and, um, you know, trying to inspire us to achieve high aspirations. A: And I think for me that was always something that was very important. I think I always knew that being a part of–like as the Latinx community, I think there is a lot of expectation because of the way there's a lot of racial tension, especially with immigrants in the United States. I think there's always, for some reason the pressure to impress a lot of the times. A: You have to impress in order to somehow get acceptance or to somehow show, Oh, just because I'm Latino. Just as worthy or are just as capable as, you know. Another person. I think that that's something that a lot of minorities face is this idea of, oh, you have to be the smartest person in the room or you have to have a huge accomplishment so that as, you know, as a race together, as an enthicity, we are able to show people or prove like no, we're capable people were hardworking, are smart where dedicated, passionate, creative. Hey, I think that that holds a lot of pressure. Certainly. And definitely now, some argue that it shouldn't have to be that way. A: But there's certainly that feeling every now and then, now and again. But I think going into college for me, I think a lot [about] being a McNair Scholar and for me being a first-generation college student. And embracing part of my identity, seeing that my parents were able to come here and…an enormous sacrifice at an age where they were still extremely young. A: I think about it all the time. I mean, at my age, you know, they were coming here. And I think about that, what could, I could imagine trying to move to a completely different country with a language that I don't even know at my age sounds like an intimidating task. A: And so for me, being a McNair Scholar and having an opportunity to attain your PhD, a very high degree, a high honor. Something that very, very, very little Latinx and African Americans have really been deprived of just because of how much of just education and access have been given to a lot of white Americans over the past several decades. A: And so just being part of a very exclusive group always is a huge honor of mine. And I think for a lot of reasons, I always think about that—of being a part of the Latinx community is a huge honor. A: And I know that even though I have a lot of privileges, being born here, a citizen, my entire family are citizens, I think that there's still a lot of personal struggles. A lot of people who aren't as lucky as I was and a lot of other people. I think about them a lot. A: I think about them because I still identify with the culture. I think when my parents and I, we were able to go to Nicaragua because of that benefit. Something that a lot of people can't do, were able to go to Nicaragua and visit my cousins and my aunts and uncles. A: And I think that experience, even at a young age is very interesting. I remember going–because obviously we've gone before—and we first went when I was about eight years old and I remember bits and pieces about that, but I wasn't old enough to really encapsulate a lot of the differences of living here [in America] and there [Nicaragua]. A: We were able to go back when I was a lot older, around 14, 15 years old. And I think that time when I'm, when I really started to see kind of how huge of a world of difference it is. And how much of a just cultural shifts it is from going to places like Nicaragua to the United States. And just seeing the different ways of life of how it made me see the incredible amount of privilege and fortune–so many things that I think a lot of people take for granted. A: It definitely put a lot of things in my mind in perspective. The amount of benefits that I've been able to receive and a large part because of my parents again, taking that sacrifice and having the courage to do that. And so there's a lot of that that comes. And that's why I think there's also a huge motivator for me to not squander that type of opportunity and to take advantage of being able to be here. A: And so I think a lot of that is definitely attached to my identity. I think a lot now–I have my own personal feelings about, you know, growing up. I think what—I think of a lot, especially now as I'm getting older, I think about how when I was a little kid before I started school, my mom used to say, “Oh, you spoke a lot more Spanish.” A: When you were younger, obviously, tucked into my mom all the time. I was able to speak a lot more Spanish. But once I got into school, I mean, I was just so surrounded by speaking English that it just became more primary to me. A: And I think the sad part that I feel is that I don't ever really remember a time being more confident in speaking Spanish than I did in English. And that's always been in conflicting feeling in a lot of ways. Because I remember going to school and being in ESOL. And I think that as a program, the intentions of the program are good. I think it is supposed to help a lot of immigrant children–their parents don't speak English. So the assumption is, oh, well, this should help them not fall too far behind and they can help them speak, learn, read, write in English. A: While I definitely see it from that perspective, I also see it from a way where I felt like, you know, in a way sort of feeling like, oh, it's like Spanish is something that I have to put aside. And instead I have to focus on proving that I can speak English and have that as a primary language. A: I remember very early on because I–for first, second, third grade, I was speaking English almost basically fluently. Mostly because like I said before, I had two older sisters and so we always spoke English to each other because they've been in school for a lot longer, so now they're just used to it with their friends. A: And so I was– always remember having good English skills. But I was still in the program for a large portion of the first few years. I had to take the ESOL tests–every at the end of the year. I remember that in order for me to technically get out because I remember in sixth grade, they had put me in ESOL and I remember my mom being very upset about that because she was like, You don't need that. Like, I don't understand why they would put you there. And I remember we had to go downtown and we had to fill out this form to essentially get them to not put me in there. A: And I have this very vivid memory of being there at the desk with the woman that signed the paper. And I remember she said, you know, obviously this is a big decision, like you're going to have to work really hard to make sure that you don't need it. Which at the time I laughed about it because I was like, yeah, but I'd always stuck with me because I don't know–I think that idea of like, well, I obviously don't need the program and so I think that idea of like, well, you should work harder as if I didn't already have enough skill or control to clearly prove that I didn't need it. A: But even then, like almost the whole sixth grade year, I was still in the ESOL program. I was still doing and taking that class until towards the end when I guess somebody was at the school was like, oh hey, we just realized that this student shouldn’t be in here and then I had to switch to the regular language arts class. A: But even during my seventh grade year, I had seventh grade language arts, but I also had a supplemental English course. And I remember just being in that class and just always like it was basically a free period because I had no struggle doing any assignments. And I remember the teacher being there and she would say, you know, I remember she told me one time she was like, “I have no idea why you're here. Like you do not struggle at all. Like, I honestly have no idea why they put you in this class.” A: And I was like, yeah, I don't know. So I think for me. And even then after that obviously didn't have any supplemental classes. But in high school I still like to take the ESOL exam because ESOL exam, in order for you to completely clear it, you have to have a perfect score or a near perfect score across the different categories, not once but two years in a row. So it doesn't matter if you have two perfect scores. If they're not consecutive, doesn't count you stuff to retake the test at the end of the year. A: I was able to do it, I think by my sophomore year in high school because I remember like the extra period of time I didn't leave class, I had to go into this room and take this test for a bunch of other people. And what I thought was really funny is like I remember there's a speaking part where they play like a cassette tape or whatever and they say something and you're supposed to repeat it. A: And I remember something that was recorded that even in the way that they said it in English was wrong, it was incorrect. And I remember being like, well, I think it's ironic that I'm taking this test to improve my English when even the recording itself isn't proper. A: And so there's a lot of feelings in that. And I think that growing up now, I feel like having this. I don't want to call it subliminal message, but the message of–I had to prove time and time again that I could speak English. And English was the most important thing that I had to know in order to succeed. A: So part of that, I think also makes me feel bad because I know that as a result, my Spanish isn't as good as a lot of other people because I very rarely use it. I only really use it to communicate with my parents. And if I ever go to Nicaragua or I'm with my cousins, then obviously I have to use it. A: And I think help working has helped a lot. I think working, communicating with more people and speak Spanish has certainly helped me be more confident because I used to be very insecure about it. I used to not want to speak Spanish to people because I was always self-conscious about it. A: Because I knew that if I made a mistake or I said something grammatically incorrect, that would be made fun of or because there's a huge thing in the Latinx community, especially from older people to be able to speak Spanish. Because that is part of our culture, that is part of what distinguishes us. And so for as a Latinx person to not be able to speak Spanish, it feels like part of you is something wrong. A: And so over time I've been able to be more confident. There are certainly things that I would like to improve because I would like, you know, whenever I have children, I'm able to teach them how to speak Spanish because I do want them to have that skill because I do think that it's incredibly valuable, not just being able to communicate with people who speak Spanish, but it is a cultural thing. A: It is something that is part of, you know, their heritage. And I think that it would be a shame to me to feel like not being able to share that with them. And so I've always certainly had those feelings, I guess, about my English and Spanish and I think that as an identity, I think that those are things that I've always have had sort of lingering around. A: But as I get older, I think that there's certainly an ability to improve on those things. I'm feeling more satisfied and I think recognizing that those things and saying, “okay, these are things that I went through and hopefully I've learned a lot from them and being able to share that experience. And I know how that feels. A: And what I feel very happy about is, for example, my nephew. I feel like something I always thought was really, really cool was whenever he spoke at a very, very young age, he understood the difference [between] speaking English or Spanish. And he would speak English to me, to his mom, to his aunt, like he knew who to speak English to. A: But when it came to my parents or to his dad, he would speak Spanish. You would know that oh, they understand better when I say it this way as opposed to this way. And it always impressed me that even at a very young age he was able to sort of put those things together. A: And I hope that, you know, every once in a while, I'll ask him, “How do you say this in Spanish?” So that he will say it and a lot of the time he will get it right or he'll make a couple mistakes, and me and my mom will try and correct him. And I think that it's important to see that. A: And so I, I guess in a way I hope that him growing up, he doesn't grow up feeling the way I feel where it's like not having that side of your culture and your heritage, but being able to embrace in how both a part of your life. A: So I think overall, I guess those are the main things that are part of my identity and culture. And I think that is a huge part of it. A: And I certainly also don't want to say that a person who is Latinx that doesn't speak Spanish at all is any less or any less part of the culture because a lot of the time sometimes you live in a family through adoption or something like that and you just don't have access. A: There are a lot of people from different cultures that, you know, don't know Korean or Vietnamese or whatever language their original family would normally speak. They just don't. And so there is a little bit of stigma there that I think that there's something that should be a little more talked about for sure. A: So I don't want to say necessarily that if a person doesn't, that makes them bad or, or, or anything like that, I just think from my feelings that's something that I've always had to grapple with myself. A: And so I think for me that I just would hope that if you have an opportunity to do that, you have the choice to. A: I think overall, I guess those are kind of bits and pieces of stories and different things that I kind of have, that have formed the way that I sort of identify, I guess, from that side. Aron Muci (M): Wonderful, thanks so much for sharing all that information, Abel. I have one question for you and then we'll wrap up. M: No pressure in this question. So if you don't have anything to say, it's no big deal. We can move on. M: I'm curious to know if you've learned anything about your cell with respect to your identity or with respect to anything else that you've discussed here today, in moving to Hays, Kansas? If that transition from away from Wichita to a smaller city in Kansas has enabled you to see anything or change your perspective in any way? Or if it's been confirming or in some way just kinda reassuring to show you how close and how connected things are. But you can, if you have anything to share about your transitions at Hays, Kansas from Wichita, that would be kind of interesting. A: Uh-huh. Yeah. I think I think this past year as a whole. I don't know how much of it is obviously being in a pandemic. And so you're a lot in your house a lot more than you probably would be, but it certainly has put a lot of people in a very introspective mood of seeing themselves and spending a lot more time in here. A: So if you sort of start to think, oh, what am I doing with my life? How are things going? A: And I think that for me being on my own for the first time, developing, maturing. I've taken a lot of, you know, I've enjoyed the process because it's helped me sort of what you've said–learn a lot more about myself. A: And there are certainly things that I've started to really learn about myself and really see in a broader way, both in a lot of different ways. And I think that that has certainly been a lot. A: I mean, moving to a smaller town, there's a huge difference in culture and people that you're seeing interacting. So before, I mean, living at Wichita: it's social. It's the most populated city in Kansas. You are seeing so many people, different people from different backgrounds. And that is really huge. A: And living in a smaller town like Hays, where the majority of the population is white, obviously you're seeing a lot less diversity. Being obviously in college and college town. You definitely see a little bit more because it's a university and so it's a little bit more open in that way. A: But I mean, if you are just walking around all of the stores, you're going to see a lot more, a lot less diversity. And I think that that is a little bit of a difference in that sense. A: And I've spoken to people that are like, yeah, when I was younger, I didn't have that many [Latino] people. I was the only [Latino] person. I was the only Mexican or something like that. A: And for me, I used to be made fun of or I was picked on or I was isolated and so I felt different. And so learning a lot more of that and seeing that sort of difference of city to a small city, it certainly has seen a lot of stuff. A: And being in [the McNair’s Scholar] program where, I mean, there were about four of us that were Latino. And I felt really excited about that. But I also realized in our program that there wasn't a single black student there. A: And I'm sure it wasn't intentional, but it was something that was interesting to me. And it was definitely something that–it was curious. And so there were definitely a lot of interesting things. A: We were able to have diversity in psychology class and we talked a lot about racial issues and LGBT Q class. And it was such an interesting open class where we were able to really talk about how we were feeling about stuff and have this open conversation. A: Especially in the city [Lawrence, Kansas] and the [University of Kansas] campus there are a lot of minorities that have faced a lot of racism and just blatant discrimination. A: And it's sad to hear, really sad to hear a lot of what people have gone through. And I fortunately haven't really experienced that myself. But it's definitely saddening to see that in a lot of ways. A: But a lot of people certainly worked through and worked really hard to make sure that that doesn't keep them down because, I mean, you have to keep working and moving forward. A: So in that sense, that makes it definitely puts things in perspective that there's a lot of, I guess, privilege in being, like I said before being surrounded with more diversity. And that's why there's a huge call for it, because it's important to freely associate yourself with people from different backgrounds to really understand them and to really see their perspective and their views and how their differences. A: And then not to see it as a threat or as being afraid [of diversity[. But seeing, oh, this person is very different than a lot of people have a lot of stereotypes because of the media or whatever. A: I think we're seeing real people in really talking to them and really understanding them. A lot of the time helps. But I think that that's something that I certainly have seen moving out here [Hays, Kansas]. A: And I think overall, the introspective, there are certain things that I've certainly have learned and seen that I think moving forward will certainly help me develop more and become more confident in myself and who I am and all of that I think is a huge benefit for sure. M: I have one other question, and this is in relation to your Twitter. And just trying to think about how often it is that you post what I'll just describe as “political post” or in one way that is dealing with politics and current events and politics of today. M: I'm just curious if you can speak a little bit to why it's been important for you to work on expressing your political voice. And what that's…and If you've ever learned anything about yourself in that way. A: Yeah. It's certainly something that, um, has become more a part of being–I think I've always had feelings and ideas even at a very young age. I remember even if freshmen, sophomore year with a lot of different issues coming up, I think that that is very important. A: And I think that I had a lot of certain political mindset. I think that I've always been somebody who values conversation, who values hearing other people's perspectives. A: Even if I don't agree with them. I find it because, I mean, I'm a person who is very inquisitive and wants to understand people. A: So understanding people's perspectives a lot of the time helps me see, okay, so I think of it this way. They think of it that way and it certainly helps develop that. A: For me, as I get older, especially with how things have been the past few years, I think that there's a huge push, especially for the younger generation, to have a more open mindset to a lot of different things. A: And I was raised–I've always said this–I was raised to respect people and I was raised to–I was never raised to hate on anybody. A: I remember meeting people from all different walks of life, whether they had different sexuality, different races, different whatever and I never had a harsh judgment of people. A: I always have this very early memory of being in sixth grade in our science class. And that was when the pregnant man, who was big in the news. And I remember sitting at a table and we're all talking about earlier. That's crazy. A: Because at the time, I mean, you didn't understand like, why that was I think I remember my teacher saying like, Oh, it's because he was a woman before, but now as a man, but he was pregnant before. And so that's sort of how it happened. A: And I remember when that [thought became] processed I was like, Oh, that's interesting. I didn't really think of it in a broader sense or anything that was I didn't think of it necessarily as abnormal. I was just like, Wow, that's really interesting. A: I've always had that ideal and I've always been somebody who, you know, I'm a huge person that wants to get along with a lot of peoples. So the last thing I wanna do is ever make somebody feel uncomfortable or, you know, in that way. A: So I've always been careful about what I say, how I say things. A: Especially now with how people use slurs and stuff like that. I've always been somebody who when somebody says, “Oh, you shouldn't say that because that hurts or offends somebody.” A: I was very receptive to that extremely early. If I heard somebody say, Well, yeah, I know that sucks. Don't say that because it may offend this person or this group or offend me. And I wouldn't say it again because I was like, oh no, like I'm not going to ever make somebody feel bad or I'm never ever going to make somebody feel– offend somebody. A: So I think that that's something that has certainly grown to be more tolerant of other people to being receptive. A: And so I think using a political voice is important a lot of the time, especially as a minority. Because a lot of the culture of the US is built on the identity of white America. And I think that trying to cross those bridges and actually make it the melting pot that it claims to be, uou have to be able to engage in these conversations. A: And a lot of the time, you have political stuff where, you know, because a lot of people aren't politically active through privilege, I think is a huge difference. A: So for example, like I said before, I have a huge privilege being somebody who was born here; I'm a citizen; all of my immediate family are citizens. So looking at an issue like immigration, immigration doesn't really affect us directly because we don't have to worry about deportations. We don't have to worry about does this law change anything here or there. It doesn't really do anything for us. A: But again, that's part of the thing where I have– my best friend does get impacted by that. Other people that I know definitely get impacted by that. And so being able to speak to them, understanding, I sit on a position of privilege that I have the not necessarily the responsibility, but more so like I feel like, you know, almost I don't want to say an obligation because that would insinuate that you if you don't do it, it's bad. But I do feel like an obligation that I have to do it because there are a lot of other people that would like to but can. A: And that's why I've put a lot of attention to learning about different things, learning about different issues about or know about an issue. I want to learn more about it. I want to be well-informed. I want to be understanding and explain this because a lot of people don't take that time to really learn about the complexities of stuff. A: And I find a lot of the social media stuff, especially with the past four years. I mean, with the president [Trump] that we had, I felt like I was almost always having to say, here's why this is wrong or here's why what is happening here is an issue. A: Because it's easy to just read a headline and take it for face value. But not understand exactly why. A: In the grander scheme of things, it doesn't make sense. And I felt like I wanted to express that to some capacity. A: Obviously on social media, it often feels like you're yelling or whatever, but I'm always open to those conversations. A: I feel like now with how much of a divide there is…I have a friend of mine who knows how political I am, and we both agree on a lot of issues. He's like, how do you feel? A: Because a lot of the conversation now is how different are people because of the divide of Democrat, Republican, liberal, conservative, whatever they say. Oh, we're more split than we've ever been. A: Part of me, because he asked, Do you feel like things have actually felt different?, I feel like in some ways there is because I remember even in 2016 before Trump was elected, I think that I remember having a lot of conversations with Republicans. What is your stance on this or that? And really gauging having a conversation, having a debate, not an argument, but just understanding what their position is. A: I feel like over time that has shifted from if you're different from me, like we can't have a conversation because I have to try to convince you that I'm right and you're wrong. And not that one side isn't wrong. A: Because I think that there are a lot of issues nowadays that have become political issues for no reason. I do think that there are some issues where you're just like, I don't understand why you believe this way. A: But I would still like a conversation because I want to understand where you're coming from. Why do you believe it or see it this way, as opposed to why a lot of other people think of it this way. A: But I feel like those conversations are harder to have because it's more sensationalized, it's more immediate anger. A: And I've had people who maybe a few years ago I would have been okay with having a conversation with but now are just so entrenched—because everybody is in their own echo chambers–and so you're not able to have a conversation because people don't really see that idea of, let's understand each other and try and see what's going on here. And I feel like that's not really happening. A: But I don't know. I don't know what the future is. I feel like obviously there is a divide and I don't know how that will get rectified, but I do think that I'm a little bit more, I guess calmer. Obviously, past this election, but I haven't been posting as much as I used to. A: But there is still a lot of–there's still a large push. A: I feel like with their younger generation, with Millennials and Gen Z, I feel like we see a lot of injustice everywhere and legitimate injustice everywhere. And I think that we growing up want to be part of an inclusive, tolerant society–a true, United States of America that isn't divided. A: I feel like part of that is understanding and being there. A: When you see injustice regardless of whether it is in your community,and saying, “Hey, this is wrong, this needs to be fixed or this can't continue.” A: I think that that's a huge part of it because, you know, being a minority, you see that a lot, you see a lot of injustices and discrimination and racism and all this other stuff. And you just want to hopefully live in a society that isn't that. A: So I feel like that's part of another reason I guess, that explains kind of thought process of being vocal about it and sharing that and saying, “this is wrong and we need to understand, respect people and understand like, you know, if it's not your life and it's not hurting you, that it shouldn't really make you upset. And it shouldn't have this reaction of immediate anger, hate, or fear, whatever it is.” A: But embracing people and just letting people live freely. And I think that that's kind of what I do a lot, at least on social media, is trying to invoke that and speak more freely about those type of things. M: Okay. Wonderful. Thanks so much. Abel. I don't have any other questions for you or anything like that. So we have gone for about an hour here. M: Do you have any questions for me about how this project will be used or anything like that? A: No, I don't think so. M: I think I'll get back in touch with you if we want to follow more with anything else in particular, as I mentioned, it would be really great if you could share with us some social media posts, if you have anything that you'd like to share as an example of an expression of your identity in one way or another that would be really helpful for our project. But otherwise, I just want to say thank you and don't hesitate to reach out if your mind changes on anything related to this project. Like I say, if you would choose to be anonymous or if you would choose to withdraw your information from being used in the project, you can always do that at any time. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Abel Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Nicaragua to Wichita, Kansas. Description An account of the resource Abel lives in Wichita, KS and is the son of two Nicaraguan parents. He was a McNair Scholar during his time at the University of Kansas: he has also traveled to Nicaragua. He appreciates how his parents shared Nicaraguan food, and celebrations. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2000s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Wichita, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_fwelbupx" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_fwelbupx/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland Abel Trimmed"></iframe> Community Education Identity Language Nicaragua Wichita https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/a80289b74a62a444ef8814961d1b9348.PNG dcbefce5ad613cfc1b9e45a91d86bbfd https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/7d385b92983cf80f8545b25ee018a666.PNG 6a1503b70bc62c30d17048a66d7aeec8 https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/3b48dfd9646d41319e16b0e06222d8b6.PNG 2c149f5691818900728950719970093e Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Language of Interview Spanish Format Video, audio only, text only Video Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Yuvia Serna City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Uruguay and Paraguay Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Lawrence, Kansas Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Agustina Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Paraguay and Uruguay to Lawrence, Kansas. Description An account of the resource Agustina is a student at the University of Kansas. She is from Paraguay but has also lived in Nicaragua and Uruguay. Agustina arrived in Kansas to further her education at the University of Kansas. She talks about the importance of education, what it is like to be Latina, as well as the cultural differences she experiences. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Lawrence, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <br /><iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_uo81lc6y" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_uo81lc6y/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland Agustina Trimmed"></iframe> Community Education Identity Lawrence Paraguay Uruguay https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/f8d98cc250cf01fc422cc230a62635a1.jpg 58c6489719a313999a82541c9b840e29 https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/3e1e317c2e304f06d10d9fe7749984f9.jpg f38e8234d20c2ba9b0f550448bb9cc46 https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/0e0e1ee5849f5dc3d1749897cb410c03.jpg de04603d906aea786f8a6d7bdb62175c https://comingtotheheartland.org/files/original/e2e668a0ce2845ab44fdd8af1f76f621.jpg c3c669ed4a38852cbcdf0183f29a71b2 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Format Video, audio only, text only Audio Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Yuvia Serna City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Chiapas, Mexico Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Kansas Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Aileen (A) Yuvia (Y) A: My parents both immigrated here, they came at different times. But my dad came from Chiapas, Mexico and my mom came from El Salvador. And she came, I think, when she was 17 or something and she was a house cleaner, but she went back and forth from Mexico to California, to El Salvador to California. A: Then when my dad came, I think he came to work [in] agriculture probably. He also went to California first. A: But they got married in Mexico, had my brother and Mexico and then they would live in California for part-time and then go back for a few years for two of their kids because my older sisters were born in California. A: And it was for me, I was born in Kansas, obviously. A: But it's interesting because it's like a whole, it's a whole different life with them. There's so many things that I didn't know, so many experiences that are so bizarre to me. A: I remember my mom was telling me that she worked on a coffee farm and she's like, yeah, they pay me like $0.05 a day. I'm like, Mom, that's not working. And she's like, No, that's fine. We bought tortillas. Mom. That doesn't…No! A: Or she'll just talk about like having to catch three buses when she was like seven to go beg her dad for shoes, like money for shoes to go to school. And it's like, it's weird, it's just like one or like one generation off. But the things that they've experienced is barbaric. A: And I think that it makes us as a generation feel really guilty because here we are sitting pretty in our air conditioned homes and our kids have all these gadgets to play with and all the time they're just like, I didn't have that when I was little or when I complain about you probably maybe you did. I don't know. You probably did. A: But the different parenting styles that I've noticed, like our generation doesn't want to hit their kids and our parents. They would beat our [expletive] if we did anything wrong. And they're just like, Well, I got beat in school. I'm like, Okay, but I didn't beat you in school. Why would you–why would you do that? A: And it's just so fascinating because they're not bad parents. It's not just, it's not just them. It's across cultures. I've noticed. It's Latinx people, it's black people, It's Asian people. All immigrant parents are very similar when it comes to this stuff. A: But there's just a disconnect. It's almost as if like it's like when they grew up they were just, I don't know, like objects that people could control. So then when they were older, That's what they expected from young kids. A: And I've noticed that with older people now when it comes to voting and social justice, they're really annoyed with younger people because it's like, well, why did they have to be out-spoken like this and this, and I think that it’s them projecting because they never got to do that. They just, they just didn't. And it's so weird. A: But the biggest thing that I struggled with was one that guilt that I wasn't living up to my potential for everything that they did come in here, working shit jobs–four jobs at a time to provide for their kids. A: And what am I doing? I studied political science and I graduated, but like I'm not actively doing anything with my degree and I feel so terrible because they've put in so much effort for us. A: And I felt like I just kinda came up like a dud. Like what am I doing for them? A: But just like the guilt that we have to validate, they're coming here and make it worth it. A: Even though it was their choice. I wasn't around, I didn't contribute to them coming here, but I don't know. But guilt has been a big thing for me. A: And I guess the second thing is having that disconnect to the motherland. Like we got a taste of their culture, but it's all Americanized. And so a lot of us don't speak Spanish. I do, but mine is very conversational. It's fine. I could write a paper, but it wouldn't be great. A: Then my kids will probably speak it very brokenly [sic] and not super great. Which sucks? A: But that's something that they, I think they kinda, kinda gave up hope on that because I know from my parents a lot of their grandkids don't speak Spanish and that's disappointing to them. And it's difficult. I think it feels kinda like rejection because they can't really communicate with them either. Because they had to learn English here. We had the privilege of knowing English and Spanish. A: But that is a whole different thing. I don't know if you've ever heard of what's it called linguistic discrimination. A: But pretty much when we were younger, we were interpreters for our parents, right. Because a lot of times they didn't have Spanish literature at the bank, at the grocery store. They didn't know what the hell was going on and they expected us to interpret or more like eight years old. A: And I'm at the doctor's office. Unlike mom, they're talking about your blood pressure, your cholesterol, this and because they didn't have interpreters available. And depending on where you lived in the US, if you live in a small town in Kansas, there's definitely not someone who speaks Spanish, who they're paying to interpret for you. But if you live in a bigger city, there probably is. A: But the whole thing with linguistic discrimination is that our parents had an accent. And so they got discriminated against because of that or our parents–you know that language barrier just it caused so many problems for them that we felt the pressure to fill in those gaps. And how to make it better. A: And at a young age, it kinda messes a few because if you do something wrong, like it all falls on your shoulders because you're the one that didn't interpret it correctly. So that was interesting. A: When I was an adult and went to college and learned all these things, I realized how traumatized I was, but it's fine [jokingly]. A: I don't know. I guess the last thing is because there's so many of us people my age, I want to say like a third of the people my age that I know that our Latinx, they're not citizens. And then the other half are the ones who aren't like, we have two completely different struggles. A: Like if they want to go to college, it's all out-of-pocket for them. And if we want to go to college, like maybe we'll get scholarships, most likely will get into debt. But at least that's an option for us and they don't have that. Or they can't just find a job like that and we can because we have a Social Security card. A: And it's just I don't know. Those things were interesting to navigate, but I don't know. A: Did you have any specific questions? I feel like I'm rambling. No. Y: You–you can go on. Now it's really interesting hearing your story because I can relate on so many different levels. I can echo everything that you've said just because I'm also a daughter of immigrants. Y: But you were talking about how that guilt and that sort of resentment. So as the child of immigrants, like you are, we harbored those. How do you think that impacted your future? Did you feel like because of those emotions or those sentiments, what did you do because of them in terms of like present day or in the future? What were your actions because of them? A: Yeah. Well, I think some people they kinda shut down. They're just like, no, that's not my journey. And we'll just play Call of Duty all day. Their parents complain, whatever. A: And then the other half, I think we become very type A people hyperactive. We always seem to be doing something. We feel guilty if we don't have a job, if we don't work. A: Like right now. Yes. I graduated and I'm doing part-time work, but I don't contribute a lot financially to my family. I'm mostly a stay at home mom. And the guilt that comes with that is awful because my mother had to take care of four children while cleaning house, while working in Taco Bell, while working for a newspaper. And I get to sit at home with one baby. And I think that's hard. A: Like I feel like I have no place to complain, but it just feels weird like not not working, not doing something that's moving. A: And part of that is I think the culture like we have a hustle culture now that when you're not starting a business that's worth a million dollars, like, What are you doing? You know, which that is a whole different conversation. A: But I think it worsens tenfold when there's just like that looming on your shoulder, whatever like in your brain telling you like, well, you better make it worth it. Are your parents came here for no reason. A: And then, I think another thing that is impacted, I don't know if he grew up in a multi-generational household? Like, I had my abuela in the house and sometimes we had tios in the house and then there's us and my parents. So there's a lot of us. A: But the problem with that is when my parents would bring some relatives over. A lot of times they would live in our house for a while. But these fools didn't work for a while because they didn't have social security numbers. I couldn't work. They just kinda hung out. A: And I think that was more pressured to work when you're in high school and stuff because you also have to contribute financially to your family then. A: There's just pressure all the time. It's like you don't get you don't get a break, which sucks. A: And then on top of that, I think is our problem with identities. We don't at least for me, like I'm a little lighter, fine. But when I grew up in a small town in Kansas. And so it was very obvious that it was not a white person. A: But then when I went to a bigger high school all the Mexican people, there were just like, you're not wrong. You're not Mexican. Like What are you talking about? I'm just like what? I just came from a place where they wouldn't let me be white and now you’re note letting me be Mexican, I don't understand. A: Then it's worse if you don't speak Spanish or if you have light hair, like light eyes, and it's not obvious that you're, I don't know, Chicana, I guess. That was weird. A: And like the state [Kansas] that we're in, there's not a lot of I mean, there is some diversity but not really in like a bigger places, I guess institutions, you could say, there's not a lot of people. I think there is a little more now. A: But now it's definitely cool to be diverse and to be including. But before I don't really think that was an emphasis that they had. So that's the story. Y: Okay. So if you could talk to not necessarily one specific person in your family, but someone in the generation before you, older than you, what would you like them to know about your experiences now? A: That they don't have to, that we know their struggle. They told us even if they didn't say the words every single day. Like we know and we feel we feel guilty for it or we feel responsible. A: And so it's not, even if I don't become president or whatever, I hope that what I did was enough and that what they taught me was enough. And I'll always show respect to the janitor, to the CEO with an equal amount that I'll never like. A: You and I were in college, which is great. But when we walk into an administration building, we don't see white people cleaning it. We see our people cleaning it? I'll never look down on them for that. Yeah, that's it. Y: And then to reverse, what do you want the generations to come to know about your experiences are what you want them to. Skills, Tips A: yeah. Y: advice. A: I hope that they continue to educate themselves on length, true history, to not fell separated like Americans versus us. Because we were here first, we are native. We absolutely are, like know who you are, know your roots. Like no real American history. A: The [expletive] they taught us like do your research. That way you never take for granted what's going on. And I don't know, at least right now, the big thing is like vote because I know my parents, they worked hard as hell to be able to vote and they voted ever since they were able to. A: But there's a lot of people in my generation who don't think it matters or who've fallen into that trap. Like they'll do it but they don't put research into it. They don't care about it. Just like know your rights and remember them because we worked hard for them. Just that. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Aileen Subject The topic of the resource An oral history from Chiapas, Mexico to Kansas. Description An account of the resource Aileen’s father is from Chiapas, Mexico and her mother is from El Salvador. In this interview, Aileen shares some of her thoughts about generational differences as well as her past experiences interpreting for her parents at banks and grocery stores due to linguistic differences. She also talks about the disconnect between how she perceived herself, as Mexican, and how others, especially Mexicans perceived her, as white. Her advice for the younger generation is to continue their education. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2000s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_qpqcsur7" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_qpqcsur7/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland_Aileen_Trimmed.mp4"></iframe> Community Education Identity Mexico Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Language of Interview Spanish Format Video, audio only, text only Video Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Yuvia Serna Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Lawrence, KS Intermediate point in journey (1) City/State or Country to which interviewee (or parents/grandparents) traveled before coming to current point of residence Ecuador Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ana Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Ecuador to Lawrence, Kansas Description An account of the resource Originally from Ecuador, Ana is a student at the University of Kansas. In Ecuador, she graduated from high school and attended the International University of Ecuador to study medicine. Later, Ana found herself wanting to seek a better education and chose to attend the University of Kansas (KU) because of its location and academic reputation. She participated in the Academic Accelerator Program and thoroughly enjoyed her “excellent” experience. One of the best things about attending KU is that she feels reciprocity: she cares about the material and the professors care about her. Her advice for the younger generation is to explore the world and stay open to new experiences. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Early 2000s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Lawrence, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_myuyry7y" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_myuyry7y/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland Ana Interiview"></iframe> Language A language of the resource Spanish Community Ecuador Education Identity Lawrence Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Language of Interview English Format Video, audio only, text only Audio Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Marta Caminero-Santangelo Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Kansas City, Kansas Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Beatrice (B) Marta (M) B: Recollection of my childhood is growing up on 25th Street in Kansas City, Kansas, and it's the Argentine district. That particular district–our street had nothing but children on it. There…there were I'd say I was trying to think of how many houses and it was just like a ridiculous amount, like 30…30 plus houses on both sides. M: And which [unknown] are we in right now? B: We are in Argentine. M: Not decade…What year? B: This is like when I was five, so I–I'm 66 now. So that was 61 years ago. I was not quite in school yet, but I–I remember all the houses. And the one thing my mom always…I have eight brothers and sisters and my sister after myself passed away at the age of 17 months. B: So there we..I have seven living brothers and sisters, five girls and two boys. And at that time there was only me and the younger sister. B: And I remember all the kids and we could go out and play at the homes…were so totally different in that we didn't even lock our doors. I didn't know that, but I knew that the doors were always open and at night we didn't even lock’em. B: And my dad worked…There was on the corner of 20…I lived on 25th Street…so the corner of Strong [Avenue] and 24th was a steel plant and that's where my father worked for years and years and years. B: And the kids would go out to play around lunchtime. And when that whistle blew at four o'clock, we knew we had to be home. Four o'clock if we weren't home, we were in trouble because we all ate together. That's the one thing I remember is all eating together as a family. We may not have liked what we were eating, but that's what we're going to eat. B: But as I got older and I went into school–there was a school, a Catholic school right across the street. So everything was close to–the school was just down the road, not even a half a block away. B: There was a local grocery that's where most of–all our groceries were bought because we didn't have the stores like we do now, where you can go from Price Chopper, Kroger, wherever these stores, and we'd go out and play. B: But the interesting part about all of us playing is that we had enough for a couple of teams, baseball, which is what we played. The people down the street and across. So a caddy corner to where we live, a cornfield, somebody planted a cornfield. So in order to get to the ballfield, which was on 24th street, we'd have to run through the cornfields and I don't know what it was about it, but we could have walked, but we always had to run through these cornfields because I think we watched too many scary movies. B: But we'd get there. We’d play and then [at] four o'clock, the whistle would blow because it seemed like before you knew it, it was done. And we were back at home eating dinner. B: We lived in the–we were the second house on–on the west side of 25th Street. But like I said, we had–we had neighbors. It was–she was an older lady, but all her grandkids were always out there. So she practically raised your grandkids, which was very typical of a lot of parents–grandparents, they had their grandkids. Kinda like it is now. A lot of kids are being raised by their grandparents, but they were always at our house. B: Mom would say, well what's more, one more mouth to feed. But we thought we lived in a humongous house. We had a small porch. So of course, my desire is always to have a small porch, which I still don't have. But I have a deck in the back. B: But we–we–we would–we'd eat dinner and it just seemed like all we–we couldn't go out to eat…play afterwards because you start getting dark. And if we did, it was right in that…around the yard. But I mean, I'm not kidding you. That's the street that had the most kids. The kids were like–each family had at least five kids. I would say one of the families down the road, the Monroe family had 12. So they can have a baseball team all on their own. B: But we grew up with a lot of these kids. Lot of them were not my age. My cousins were my age, but I mean, there was [sic] houses all up and down the street. And lot of them –1965 is when they rebuilt that area, urban renewal came in and my family moved from 25th Street to 26th and Metropolitan [Avenue], and that's where my mother still lives now. So they've got a brand new house. B: I tell everybody when I because I–went to I went to St. John the Divine School for a couple of years. And then it was, well, of course, Catholic schools have always been schools which pay for and my folks could not afford to send me there. So I went to the elementary school which is three blocks down. It's still there. And then I finished there. B: In the meantime, I went and I graduated from Emerson [Elementary School] and I went to the middle school, which was Argentine middle-school, which is now it used to be the high school, but it's fifth grade and then it was sixth grade, you would go to the middle school. And I was one of the last…last to graduate from Argentine High School in 1972 before it became JC Harmon. B: But my friends, they didn't live on my same block because they were all either older or younger. But I had a girlfriend on 24th street and a girlfriend on 26th Street that we came and back then they had alleys so you would come across the alley and it wasn't like crossing streets. You wouldn't have to worry about getting run over or anything. B: So we hung out together, which to this day we're still friends. We see each other. Well, before all this [Covid-19 pandemic] happened, we were seeing each other once a month, getting together for lunch or breakfast or something. And they have families of their own and grandkids. B: Now, I’ve…I've been married for 33 years, but we do not have any children. I have lots of nieces and lots of nephews. We have…I think we have 17 nieces and nephews and 11 great grand nieces and nephews? On my side. Yeah. And my husband is–his family is all in Mexico City and he's got three-bit three. Let's see. He's got two brothers and a sister. And they have three…six…nine. So he's got like ten…ten nieces and nephews. M: So are you in pretty good touch with all these nieces, nephews? B: We just talked to my, uh, my nephew in Cancun. We were calling them about the hurricane to make sure he was okay. He said We're waiting for Delta. And I said, Oh, the plane? He started happy that the hurricane is it Why are you waiting? Because there's that the name of it he goes, Yeah, they used up all the letters of the alphabet. B: And I told my husband, Oh my God, I can't believe I did. That. It was Delta Airlines. B: Yeah, we still keep in touch. He does have a brother that moved here and he’s in Independence [Missouri]. We don't see him. We haven't seen them very much since all this would pretty much stay away from everybody. B: The only one [person] I see is my mom because she's–she's 89. And so for about two to three months nobody saw her. We were too worried that anything was going to happen. And I told my sister, you know, I'm at home all the time. I don't go anywhere. There's no reason why can't; my mom's going nuts. B: So I see her two or three times a week. I'll go down there and I go say “come, let’s take a ride.” So we'll take a ride and it's kinda helped her with her sanity. I think if I wasn't able to get in my car and go and just take a ride. I'd go nuts too. Yeah. Yeah. B: But it's…I see it so different when we're growing up. I mean, we did what they told us to do. These are kids. Back then…We all–we all married. And my wife, I have a brother who got divorced and then a sister who got divorced and we were all so devastated–because at that time, divorce was not one of the things that you saw that much, you know–but it was something it was it was a big step for me because being the eldest of all of them, I thought, you know, why should somebody be in something that they're not happy with? Life is too short. B: So I mean, it's, it's a lot of things change. But one of the things I'd like all my nieces and…I'd love for them to carry on the tradition of food. A lot of–some of the younger ones don't know how to cook. Now I do have one niece that cooks up a storm. She makes us look bad. B: But they…and we are all married too different…in different I married a Mexican, my sister married a Cherokee Indian. We've got all kinds of nationalities. And so it's different and you've learned a lot of different things. You may not like everything, but you either–you…don't have to live with them. You know, the hard part is living with somebody. So it's been interesting, but we've all learned. B: Just recently within the last couple of years. Well, we get along really well, [my] brothers and sisters. We have our arguments, but then it's–it's over. It's not anything that we're mad for years For anything like that. But within the last couple of years, we've–we've gotten together once a month to eat: we’ll go someplace and eat–just all the siblings. We’ll take my mom with us. B: And when–when the pandemic started, I still have a sister that says I'm not going anywhere. I'm not going to go on scared. She's scared. Well, I said I understand that you just have to be careful who you are around. And so we–we've been ordering from local places and we bring it into the house and they come over to–will go to their houses. B: And next, as matter of fact, next…Sunday, we're gonna get together at one of my youngest sisters’ [house]. The next to the younger sister it’s her turn. So we're gonna go to her house and have–I don't know what we're having yet. I didn't even ask her. Usually I'm the first to ask because I wonder what? She's going to have stuff and we're all going to go over there and it's really nice because even the boys go. B: And lot of time…You know, when my dad passed away in 2011…and he…the only thing he asked is that we take care of mom, which, you know, it was kinda like a given but he had to hear it. And he [unknown] the boys. Once he heard it from the boys, he was okay and he passed on. But the boys… B: All the girls have said we are so amazed that the boys have taken on the responsibility that they had because they were anything mom wants or needs, come and mow the grass and all that is done. B: But for years it's only been a year-and-a-half, but before that, somebody has always stayed with her. B: We have a sister that got divorced a few years back and so she went in to stay with my mom. She's there so we don't stay like every…if somebody was there every night. But it wasn't something that was a burden for us because we were just we…were raised that way, you know? B: I think I see a lot of the younger kids where it would be hard for them to do that. Because they carry around. My sister says “My kids already said that they're going to put me in a nursing home. I'm going to kick their butts.” B: I am I–I told my sister, my youngest sister, go, what am I gonna do? I said, I don't have kids. There's nobody to take care of us. And she says…She goes, “I'm going to take care of you and Ryan, her youngest, is my god son. She says “he's going to take care of me. He's already told me.” I said I've got all these kids are going to take care of me, so I don't think I have to worry. B: But I–I–I want to in growing up, I was used to being around just my area. Argentine was just the area. I thought that's all that existed. I had no idea that there was Turner. I had no idea there was Missouri. I had no idea. B: And when I went to high school. We ventured out to the Turner one day and got caught by truancy officers. But we told him we just took the wrong turn. I guess they are more vulnerable than we thought and we–we went back to school, but it was fun. B: I mean, I can't say I never skipped school because I did my mom [unknown] does and you thought I didn't know but I did. So we the girls say my girls, I know they're gonna do the things I did right there. B: So from–from high school, I got a scholarship, full ride scholarship, and I went to Pittsburg State University. I graduated with an accounting degree. First semester was really rough for me because I've never been away from home. I always wanted to call home. And back then you had to pay for your phone calls. Mom says, I remember her telling me one day, “We love you but you can't call the time. I can't collect want me anymore.” B: But it wasn't that it was just time for me to fly off. And then next, that was the first semester. Second semester, I didn't even come home because by then I was used to it and it was okay. And she was worried that I'd flown the coop. B: But I think part of my first semester [of] college was hard. I lived in a dorm. I had a roommate. She didn't like me. And I thought, why doesn't she like me? You know, she was a white gal and I thought “must be because I'm Mexican.” I mean, because people said, “Well, you gotta be careful because when you go away, people are not going to say, oh, you're different.” B:And so she…what ended up happening is that…she moved out of the dorm and I couldn't understand why that was one of the things that devastated me a lot because I thought I don't understand. B: And all the other girls were white girls from little small towns and I had no idea people lived on a farm with chickens. But I got to meet them, we'd go and stuff. B: But so next–the following semester, this girl that moved out came to see me. And she wanted to apologize for her moving out. So I want to know why you did it. I mean, what happened? Is it because I'm Mexican, Is it because I want to know because I'm out here in the wilderness not knowing what the heck. B: She says, Well, I had a boyfriend, she had a boyfriend. And Pittsburg State University down in Pittsburgh, Kansas is Bible Belt–Baptist Bible Belt country. She said “you weren't Baptist.” I said “What?” She said “you weren't Baptist.” She goes in and I could be that…I as like “I’m Catholic.” She goes, I know that was because you had to be Baptists. That was a shocker to me. I mean, I just, I guess I didn't realize at that point that there was different religions either. B: It was a big, big step for me and I had people, I've made all kinds of friends. I've got people that are, I don't know what religions there and it doesn't make any difference what they are. It's the person that they are. B: So I finally graduated from college, came back to come home and after being out on your own, it's hard. So I told my dad I–I didn't want to talk to him. But I said “Dad,” I said “I want to buy a house.” And go, Oh my God. Why do you want to buy a house? You know, you're not married. But what if I don't want to get married? I think it'd be a good investment, blah, blah, blah. So he finally agreed. B: And I bought my first little house. And this little house was the house that I met my husband like seven or eight years later, and I'd already been living in it. And when we got married, he moved in there and fixed up the house. The house looked totally different when he moved when we moved out, then when I moved in, but because he's very handy. Very, very handy. B: So like I said, we moved from there and when…I worked in different…my first job as a matter of fact, before I got married, my first job, I couldn't believe that I got a job. I've always been in the oil and gas industry. And I had my hiccups there too. You know people–people are not used to seeing different people of different colors that were used to the white people. And my boss, who was a very strong Catholic, so I thought, oh, we’re going to get along. B: Oh my God, he was–I remember one day he said “You are too gregarious” and I thought I don’t know that word. I was just freaking out. I didn't know what that word meant, so I had to go home and look at that. But what's wrong with being happy with talking and what's wrong with that word? But he was just…people would talk to me before they would talk to him and he didn't like that. He wanted to be the main one. But my years there…I was probably there 12 years and then they–the company moved to Houston. B: So from there I had various jobs but they've always been in the industry. My last job was–was the same way and they moved from…to…they all moved to Texas because that's the hub for the gas and oil industry. And I told…I was working this job. I told my husband, I…these hours are going to be crazy, but I mean, it's a job. Let's look. Working 60 hours a week. It was like crazy. And some days I'd see my husband's somedays I wouldn’t. B: I thought I was already 50 by then and I said, you know, I better start thinking about what I want because if I don't, then I might be by myself or might not and I have to decide what I want for me [sic]. B: So when I was like, I was by then I'd already been there [at the company] seven or eight years. I told my husband after the first of the year I'm going to look for a job. He didn't believe me. B: But I said I am. I said I think I need to be home more and I'm going to try to find something really close to the house. I know it's not going to pay well, but you know what? That's what I'm gonna do. B: So I went to go work for the Turner School District and my sister says, “Do you want to be a secretary?” I said “No, not really.” I said, “But I want my time to be busy.” I don't want to have to worry about three minutes. I'm well, probably five minutes from my house, three miles. I said I can do that for five or six years before I retire. And that'll be okay. I'll be alright. B: And at first, I didn't like it–because I thought I'm not doing anything that I learned all these years in school–but after the first year, my–my mind kept saying it's okay. You just do a check-in, you do it, get it done. So anyway, I wound up working there for six years and I retired two years ago…January it will be two years that [sic] I have retired. B: [Since then] I've been at home doing whatever I want to do and it's been great. It's been really good. But I tell my younger nieces, nephews, it's gonna be…because I have one that's a teacher and she says it's so hard. And the kids and I go, Yeah. It's hard…with I mean, I didn't have kids but I tell my mom, I don't know how you did it. You had eight kids and they have two kids and they're complaining. B: And she goes, well, I was always at home. I said, yeah, you were always at home, but I tell you what, I'd rather be working than at home with kids. I think it would be very hard. I only know because I took care of my brothers and sisters. Well, my mom was off doing–you know working sometimes. She didn't ever work out of the house but like she’d sew or she'd make food and sell it and or stuff like that. But somebody had to be watching the younger kids. So that was enough for me. B: But I'm trying to think of what else I can tell you. I don't know if I've gotten… M: I will totally agree with you that I would have gone completely insane if I hadn't been able to work while I [laughs]...had my kids. B: Well, I had my mom always says, Oh, but you made so much more money. I said, But you know, mom, it takes a while because you do you think make money, but you have to have your plan. And I said, making money at the end was not an important thing for me. I'm much happier now. B: And I didn't realize it because I thought, Oh, I'm gonna get this and this. I think I don't know. I never for a minute thought that I didn't want to retire. I mean, I knew I did, but I didn't know if we're gonna make it or not, but I think it's been–it's really been good. B: I have a friend who's 70 years old. She looks fantastic. You would never, never, never know. She looks…she looks like she's probably 60. I mean, she doesn't look bad at all. And she's scared to retire because she doesn't think she’s…she's on her own. I go, “You know what? You're gonna do fine” you're going…and she's been off for the last three months and we had a little talk last week and she says, “You know, I think I am going to be fine [cuts out] to go eat and I like to buy us have girl, you're not talking buddy. B: I used to go out all the time. I used to eat out everywhere. I said, “And you can still do that if you want. But you're going to find that that's not that important anymore and you don't have to buy something to wear at home–some days I don't even get out of my pajamas. You know, I did dress up today. Well, not dress up. Just put on a shirt… M: I love the flowers. B: Right? M: Yes. Can I ask you a couple of follow-up questions? B: Sure. M: Okay. So we were well into your story. You had talked about the different…like the different people that your siblings had married, Mexican somebody married a Cherokee and we were well into your story. I think we were past that before you actually identified yourself as Mexican. B: Oh… M: Could you talk a little bit about, like, that? Like did you think of yourself growing up as Mexican? Or what did you know about how your parents or grandparents or whoever came to Mexico…What did you know about that whole thing? B: Well, my mom…my grandmother was from Mexico. My grandfather was from Mexico. They were both Mexicans. And from what my dad tells us–told us because he's gone–is that they had money. They were–they were what they considered wealthy. And my grandfather would come here to work on the railroad. B: So that part always confused me. Okay. If you're wealthy…Well he [my father] says “We’ll you're wealthy if you're working the land.” And he says all his kids were little because my grandfather came to work, went back and he was killed. And my dad didn't talk about that for a long time, but he was five when my dad…when my grandfather was shot. And what they did was rob him of the land and the cattle. And so basically they had nothing at the end. B: I said, well, you know, dad and my dad was a very giving man. He was just whatever, I mean, his brothers…My dad was in [the] Korean War and he would send money. So there one day if he got married, he wanted to have money and grandma would say, “Well, we don't have money. Take it from what you need to.” Of course, when he came back, he says there was nothing. He says they used it all. B: You know, I kind of identify in that. Sometimes people think that because I use it as my husband's family, he came to the United States and they thought he was rich, but he wasn't rich. But he would always send money because it's, you know, hey, let's send him a little bit to get them by. B: So it was always that they've got that he had the money that he did and he didn't. And that's the way it was. My daddy said “I'd send money.” They used…and he's got money. He goes and then when I was going to come and get married, there was no money in the house. B: As a matter of fact, the house where my grandmother lived still stands. Probably built–oh gosh–it's gotta be over 70–80, now probably close to 100 years old now. And my dad got part of the house and grandma…grandma had step-children. And so the daughter was going to get some of that too. So when dad sold it, she got some, dad got some. But the house sold it and it was sold for twenty five thousand dollars. B: Can you imagine the house now? You can't even touch hours for less than two hundred thousand dollars. But the house is still standing and the guy that bought it got divorced, and so he didn't want to live there anymore. And my sister–my sister bought that house. And I want to say she's–she bought it for a little bit more than what he bought it for. I mean, he didn't–he didn't make money on it. He just got the money there. But she's got it and she's fixing it up and it brings back a lot of memories to see grandma's house there. B: But my dad would say that he lived–there was [sic] three–four families that lived in the house. The house is very small. It was like one bedroom, one bath, and there was… M: Where's the house? B: It's on 25th Street where we grew up in Argentine. And it was…there was a room, probably four by eight [feet], just real narrow, and they use that one as a bedroom. And mom said that's where she and dad stayed for a while before they moved out. But then dad had another brother and his wife, and I think it was only three families because my other aunt would only come during the day when he was working. They [would] drop them off and they were all there. B: The house is small…The living room was probably the biggest room of the whole thing, the bathroom small. And it's…it's perfect for one person, but not for a family of three different families. So I told my sister, I don't understand why you want to buy that house because I just want to keep it in the family. She's got a lot more tradition, she says, than we do. B: But when we moved down, when my dad bought the house down the street, he said that house sold for…he bought it for eight thousand dollars. I said “really, that's a lot of money.” I mean, I remember telling him that that's a lot of money. He said yeah, but, you know, we had one bedroom–one bedroom, living room, a bathroom, and then it was like a walk-through room to the kitchen. You had to walk through a bedroom to the kitchen. And that was it. B: I remember probably in the early–in the late sixties. I don't remember what dad put in a new bathroom and it was huge. I mean, there's the laundry room, the bathroom, and the bathroom that was there before became a bedroom for the boys because all the kids slept in one room; and mom and dad slept in the walk through. So we lived there most of our lives; we just thought that–that was the house. B: So I didn't–I've never really wanted a humongous house because I was comfortable in a smaller home like that. But we all live within probably six or seven miles of each other. So we're all very close. B: I have…well, actually there it's probably closer now because I had one [sibling] that moved closer in five miles within radius…all of us live within [this distance]. B: There was [sic] times when we were growing up where I moved out and then my sister went to school, came back…My brother moved to Nebraska for a few years at his job and then came back and decided he liked the area and he came and I both have accounting degrees. But he became a firefighter. And my other brother became a firefighter. B: The two brothers I have both were firefighters once getting ready to retire. The other one retired five-years ago now…and they're all younger because I am the oldest. And I have two sisters that are nurses. And I have a postal worker sister, and then the other one worked with me at the school district. B: So we all went to school. There's only one..two…one that was so close and didn't finish and we tried to get her but she didn't fish. She goes, “Eh, I'm okay.” Okay. But now she instills that in her children. M: [Unknown] that you're all you all went into basically professions that serve your communities. Fire fighter, postal worker, teacher. B: Yeah. Yeah. I–I would say I don't see you as an accountant. I love numbers. You know. I said I saw if there had been a degree and customer service or something like that, I probably would’ve. I think that's probably why I did so well in the district because I would see all the people coming in. And I enjoy people. B: And I think from–I always want to know what people were from. I want to know where they are. About their parents, siblings…because I had gone through things where I thought I don't understand why people don't…like I was telling you about my roommate. She did not like me. B: And, you know, the funny thing about her. She was so strict. She was a very strict Southern Baptist. And after her and her boyfriend broke up, she–she–she kinda went out of her own way. She was an opera. She became an opera singer, not professionally, but opera. B: And we were gonna get married. She said, I heard you're getting married. I want to sing at your wedding. I said “You do?” I said, Okay, I let her sing at my wedding and it was beautiful. She did a beautiful…opera at my wedding and she did a beautiful job. I have not seen her in probably 30 years now, but I've lost communication. She went to New York and she said, “I'm living with a guy, we're not married.” She goes, “I hope you don't get offended” that you're living with him, not me. I don't care. B: [Audio cuts out] but he's not–he's not–he's–he's…I can't remember what nationality which kinda threw me, but that's usually what happens with people that don't they they they don't know the world. She was sheltered in her own…kinda like I was in Argentine. You just learned to be around people and I've been with a lot of people they go they just insulted us…they didn’t insult me. I didn't say anything. I didn't take it personally. You know, I didn't take it personally because they're [the people who insult me] the dumb ones. M: But yeah. I mean, that’s fascinating that she wanted to sing at your wedding after she couldn't…Do you have no idea why she wanted to sing at the wedding? B: I think she probably thought, Hey, I treated her bad enough that I don't want her to think that way. B: And her family. Many times before that…No, after it was afterwards. I think twice I went to go see your family. Family was very nice. But I could tell I mean, I could tell that they weren't they were really surprised. And I said, “I don't think your mom or dad liked me.” No. No. But she says “What it is is they're not used to seeing.” She goes. B: Look, she lived. I can't even think of the name of the town because Pittsburgh, close to Pittsburgh is Joplin and then it's Oklahoma. But it's right before Oklahoma. Some[thing] Springs…Baxter Springs. She lived in a little town called Baxter Springs [Kansas]. I don't think they had any Mexicans or any kind of Hispanic groups. I think if they had blacks, it was would've been amazing. B: But I just recently…we went to my sisters. They go, we're gonna take a little road trip. You want to go? I said “Where are you guys going?” And they were going to go to Oklahoma and they're gonna go down and see the Pioneer Woman. I said, I know who she is, actually not one of my favorites, you know, I don't really wanna go. [My sisters said] “Oh, you need to get out.” [I said] “Well, let me let me know if you guys go,” because they plan stuff and then something falls through. B: So anyway, long story short, yeah, they were gonna go and I said, You know, I told my husband I think I'm gonna go ahead and go with them. I just need to get out. And he said, “Okay, go ahead and go.” I went… B: Well, my sister's roommate, I've met her before. And that's another one we've talked about her because she own…they own an ammunition plant in Winfield, Kansas, they have a lot of money. B: But you meet these people and to think down to earth. So down to earth, money is not one of the issues you can tell. But anyway, she–Sandy, my sister says, “Do you remember Noelle?” I said “Yeah, I remember her.” She says, “The only thing I asked you is don't talk politics.” I said “I'm not usually one that does.” I said, “You got it.” She goes “because, you know, they're not the same politics that we are Democratic Party or the Republican or Democrat.” She says, “We don't. We want this to be a fun-filled week.” And I said “You're telling me.” B: She goes, I know I'm going to tell my other sister that to us. Anyway, we go down there and it will go to a city called Pawhuska, Oklahoma. I think the number I read the when we were going it was like 8500 people in the city. And my concern was staying at a hotel. So we rented an Airbnb and we met owners. They're the nicest people. I mean, I was prepared to see how they were going to react to us coming. B: This is the first time in all the years that I've lived that the reaction was–there wasn't a reaction. It was just like regular people and it was kind of a good thing. It's more like there's more of a mixture now. People are just used to it, I guess. B: [Then] Sandy, my youngest sister, says, there…Noelle’s mom's coming. You guys have never met her. She goes, she's really nice, very nice lady. She originally was the owner of the ammunition plant, but as she's getting older because she's probably in her late seventies, maybe, she’s passing it on to her daughter. She says she's going to meet up with us. So we met up her and in [the restaurant] it walks is older guy–older man. B: And Sandy says, Do you know who that is? I said No. She says “that's Chuck Drummond.” I said “Chuck Drummond?” And she goes, “Yeah, you know who Ree Drummond is?” I said “The Pioneer Woman?” She says “That’s her father-in-law.” I said, “What's he doing here?” She says, “I just found out Noelle’s mom is dating him.” I said, “Oh my God.” She goes, “So just be nice to him.” She always tells me that because she knows I'm very direct. B: So we meet [sic] him. Oh, my god, this man is he was just…I was amazed because he's older, so I expected, you know, a little bit of a what's the word I want to say? Maybe he was going to be more…I can't think of a word. We weren't going to be as appealing to him, you know. B: No. No. He was just as accepting. That's what I want–that’s the word I wanted. He was the nicest man and he was…that was on a Thursday night and he says, We were just going to be there Friday and come back home. And he says, “You know what?” He says “Tomorrow, I want you girls to be ready at eight o'clock, I’m picking you up and we're gonna go for a little ride.” Okay. B: We're all ready. He took us to tour the whole ranch and where they lived. The family cemetery, which to me, I thought the family cemetery…how many people went? And we didn't get to meet his [daughter-in-law]…the Pioneer Woman because she was filming. He took us to dinner. He took us to breakfast first and then we had dinner at…there's a pizza place that they own too, and he was the nicest man. B: And I think to myself, you have 11 thousand acres of land. I complain because we have a quarter of an acre. There are people that…He talked about his ranch hand that he had. He said, “Do you like Mexican food?” and I started laughing. I said, “Are you serious?” He said, “You know how to make enchiladas?” I said, “Yes.” And he says “Girl, I'm coming to your house” and I started laughing at that. Maybe he doesn't think we're Mexican–that was my first thought [laughs]. B: What's my first thought? But he says, “I love those” and I said, “You know what, you can come to Kansas City. We're going to show you” and I told the girls, if they come to Kansas City, they’re going to have a feast because they're not the only ones that can show us around. But it was–it just depends. There's a lot of people that don't. But I mean, I remember I'm going back back [in time] again. B: But in high school, I didn't really have a lot of friends that were anything but Mexican. They were all–we hung around in a little group. Jesse, who you've talked to before, him and I are godparents to one of his nieces. And I mean, we're just because–it's because it’s my best friend's brother. B: And we didn't hang out because he was always what I told you I was with [unknown]. I would tell him. But he's old in high-school. Three years is a lot of years. You are pretty much at the same age. So we didn't hang out together. He would see us and we'd say hi and all that. But he–he is. As the time has gone on, we've seen we've seen more and more of each other. We help in the same food kitchen and different things like that. B: But just recently he [Jesse] got an award and I posted it on Facebook. One of the girls that I went to school, this girl I haven't seen them in about 40 years. I talked to them. I always talked to the people in school, but I didn't hang out with them. And now it's more…Oh, let's get together, let's do this. But come to find out this one girl married a Hispanic man. The other one didn't. It's the same boyfriend she had from when she was in… B: But as the years have gone on, all the groups were segregated. Now they're all together. B: I remember my dad used to say, it's easier if you marry your own kind. And I thought what is he talking about? But as the years went on, I understood. He said it's you know, it's hard enough to maintain a marriage to keep it intact. And if you have different…if you have somebody who's a different nationality and they have certain wants and likes or–it's harder. It's harder. That's what he meant. B: But it's been…I've had a good life. I haven't–I can't complain. The only thing I would have wanted children, but it wasn't meant to be. So that did not happen. M: Bea, I am so, so sorry, but I have another meeting at three. B: Sure. No problem. M: Don't leave yet. Hang on. B: Okay. M: I have a quick question and then I have one last thing I want you to say before three. B: Is it almost three? Yep. Oh, my God, it’s almost three. M: But we can always do a follow-up to send you an email asking for, like if you're doing this reunion with your six sisters, I'd love to see a picture of you and your sisters today and some old pictures maybe of you and your sisters to compare. That would be wonderful. B: Okay. M: Quick question is: Where was your grandfather shot and why? B: He was shot in Mexico on his ranch. And he was shot because I think my dad said that they were…[My grandmother was shot] because of the sale of cattle or something that he [my grandfather] wouldn't sell them. Because they know my dad actually know–knew who had shot him and he [the murderer] was still living. B: And I–I remember asking my dad, do you want to meet him [the murderer]? He goes “No.” He goes “I don't.” So I would have wanted to I wouldn't want to say why. I mean, a lot of it is practically out of stupidity…somebody told me to or whatever. But yeah. M: And then my last question is can you repeat, now that we're recording, the recipe for the chilaquiles with red sauce and scrambled eggs? B: Sure. You're gonna do some tortillas, you're going to fry them up, I like to make little squares or triangles. Fry them up in a little bit of oil. Put them aside to drain. You're going to cut up some onion, cut up some garlic. I put a whole onion and I put a clove of garlic. And if I feel two cloves, so it's kind of guess…and you sautee them in the oil that's remaining. Not a whole lot of oil. It's not more than one-fourth of a cup. B: And then you add tomatoes. One can of tomatoes with, you can add your jalapenos however spicy you and I'm doing blend those up, pour them into the–your skillet, saute it until it's sauteed a little bit. B: Then you take…I would start off with four eggs and then maybe add, I'd say with the can [of tomatoes] four or five eggs. And you scramble them and scrambled into your mixture. And you can salt, salt it. And then just scramble. I like my yellows mixed really good [sic], you know? And then I add the chips at the very end. And you're good to go. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Beatrice Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Kansas City, Kansas Description An account of the resource Beatrice grew up in the Argentine District in Kansas City, Kansas with several siblings. Her mother passed away when she was very young and her father worked at a steel plant. Although the family was often busy, they always ate at least one meal together. She went to Pittsburg State University on a full ride scholarship and graduated with an accounting degree. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Late 1900s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Kansas City, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_rtqyu0gn" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_rtqyu0gn/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Beatrice Heartland Trimmed"></iframe> Community Education Identity Kansas City Mexico Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Language of Interview English Format Video, audio only, text only Audio Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Joohye Oh City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Brazil Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Lawrence, Kansas Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Caio (C) Joohye (J) C: So I actually, I'm living in the United States for a second time. C: So I did my master's here [Lawrence, Kansas] for two years. And I'm doing my PhD at Department of Spanish and Portuguese. So I've been here for four years, four-and-a-half, pretty much. J: And do you consider yourself an immigrant, you think? C: That's interesting because this is something that I asked myself all the time because officially I'm a non-immigrant. Right. When I look at my visa, when I look at my I20, that–that’s pretty evident that I am non-immigrant. C: But I consider myself an immigrant. I live here. I've been here for four years. I've been it's been my socials, It's been my life. It's been my reality nowadays and I don't even I don't really know if I'm ever going back home or if I'm leading this country because I'll be here for at least three or four years until 2020…maybe 2024, 2025. C: So yes, I consider myself an immigrant. J: And you also talked about [how] you receive the Fulbright and then that's how you arrived at Miami to teach. Can you explain or can you speak more about–Was there a Brazilian community in Miami or was there relate to or how–What was it like? C: So I–my experience was pretty unique because I–I thought I was gonna get a stipend and live wherever I wanted. But I had to live on campus. And that was a historically black university [HBCU]. C: So that was interesting in a way because I come from a city called Salvador, which is considered the largest black city outside of Africa; it has a huge black–Afro-Brazilian population. C: So I was looking forward to the sharing and exchanging, like, this cultural aspects with them. And that was very positive though in this way. But I–I had to live surrounded by students and I was a TA. So there was a hierarchy and I had to be aware of that. So I wasn't–I couldn't not fully…I could not make many friends, you know. C: Regarding the Brazilians, I actually met a couple Brazilians. But they were, let's say, I have this. Maybe it's, maybe it's some kind of prejudice. But many Brazilians who live in Miami, that's my perception, hey are like upper middle-class Brazilians are middle-class, upper-class Brazilians who have a different way of seeing life as I do. So I wasn't really into those people. C: So I did make a couple other Latino friends, friends with people from other Latin American countries. That was very nice. Puerto Rico, Dominican Republic. And I gotta improve my Spanish for sure. Yeah…so. C: But most of my social circle was related to school, which was the Afro–the African-American population. So that was a microcosm. And say, you know, my experience was more of a microcosm in that university than Miami itself. C: I would enjoy the city sometimes, like on weekends. But that was, you know, that wasn't part of my daily life. I would stay on campus most of the time. C: But that was positive. I liked it so much. That's why I'm doing my minor in African Studies. African African-American studies. J: Yeah, That is wonderful. Then I saw that in a University Daily Kansan article that you, you do lead or you lead the Capoeira Club? Is that–Do you still continue to? C: I'm actually the president of the club. So we got some funds to hire an instructor. So we have classes twice a week with this instructor from Brazil. So yeah, I was the one who tried to get the funds–the funding for that. C: So yeah, I'm still leading the club and I'm also leading a Brazilian Student Association, BRASA, at KU. So I'm leading both groups. J: And could you explain more about why you decided to become president–your involvement and or like was it so that more people could be aware of these aspects of Brazilian culture? C: Well…yes. First of all, to be honest, it was because I wanted to spread my wings. I was like, I want to meet–I want to be able to meet other people from outside of the department at a personal level. C: But yes, I did want–and I do want to promote Brazilian culture. Is this something–this something I'm very aware of. C: I try to talk about Brazil as much as I can. You know, whoever I meet, whoever I meet. I try to talk about the country, about the cities, about this dynamics of race, politics. So this is something that I do all the time. C: It's political in a way because I do that in my work and my papers. I tried to include Brazil as much as I can. I try to organize events like parties, academic events. We did organize something interesting last semester. And we want to organize a Brazilian week next semester. So it is political as well. C: So yes, I have several motivations at a personal level and also at a political level. J: Does this also sort of translate over to the Lawrence Public Library? You did the Cunetacuentos or the Multicultural Storytime? Would you be able to explain a little bit more about that? C: Oh yeah. I love that. They actually have done so many things. I’ve done so many things at KU, now that you're asking. Yeah, there was a public library and the project if–as far as I remember, it was a project GRASP. If I'm not mistaken, which is the Graduate Association of Students of Spanish and Portuguese. Then some of the grad students would take turns going there and volunteer to tell to do the storytelling. So I would do that in Spanish. C: But then there was the Multicultural Storytime. And I remember, I think it was a, it was sponsored by the library. And I volunteered to tell stories in Portuguese. So I would do that. I would tell stories in Portuguese and Spanish. C: So basically half an hour on Saturdays, once in awhile, yeah. C: So, yeah, so that was a very good way of also teaching a little bit of the vocabulary. I would try to show a little bit of the vocabulary before telling the story to all the vocabulary as if I were in a classroom. So the parents and the kids would have fun and would learn and then I would do the storytelling after this. J: Okay, so we covered the Multicultural Storytime, the Cuentacuentos, the Capoeira club. Also, you did a samba, forró, and Zoom class for dance. Dancing? C: Yes. That's what I'm saying. Like now that you're asking, like, I have realized that I've done a lot of stuff here. C: Yes, some samba, forró,and zumba. It was an initiative of BRASA, Brazilian Student Association, and LAGO, Latin American Graduate Organization. C: So we would take turns, some of the students would take turns teaching whatever music style they would know. So I would teach the Brazilian [dance] styles once a month. So the class that would take place once every two weeks, and then we will take turns. C: So I would teach once a week, once a week, once a month. I taught samba; I taught forró, which is kinda resembles salsa a little bit, and Afro-Brazilian of music. Yeah, different Brazilian styles. C: And this is actually something that I want to resume because we had to stop because of the pandemic. Actually even after COVID, we will teach on Zoom for a couple of months, but then we suspended it. C: This is something I really want to resume. I want to bring this up by next semester and see who would like to volunteer to resume these activities. So again, this is me being political about spreading as much as I can about Brazilian culture. J: We've mentioned a lot of your own personal efforts in order, like you said, to promote on a personal and political level, like you said. But how do you, what do you do for yourself to connect with Brazilian culture? Do you still cook traditional foods or listen to the radio stations or read Portuguese newspapers? Or are these events also a way [to connect]? C: I'm actually, I'm actually strongly connected to Brazil because the first thing I do, after waking up, I put some podcasts. And then hear the news about Brazil. So much more into what's going on in Brazil, what's going on in the US, honestly. C: And especially because now we've been dealing with this president called Jair Bolsonaro; he is neo-fascist. Who is, you know–represents a disaster in Brazil, economic disaster, a political like, health disaster because of COVID. C: So I've been trying to follow as much as I can, you know, to keep up with what's going on there as much as I can. So I watch the news every day. I listened to podcasts. I listen to Brazilian music. C: Actually–basically, this is my daily workout. You know, before at night. I usually, I like this a lot. So I have different playlist with different choreographies, dance routines of Brazilian styles and stuff. So this is something that I do everyday. I keep looking for new songs, for example, new choreographies. C: So that's how I basically, this is basically how I worked out. I didn't say it like. C: And I'm always in touch with my friends. I'm always talking about friends and family. C: [On] social media. I follow lots of politicians and follow, lots of artists follow. Yeah. So I can, I'm still very connected to Brazil. And I'm actually here in the US because I–it's not because it was not just a dream. You know, It was not to live the American dream, to be honest, it was because the country [Brazil] is going through an economic, very serious economic crisis. So I just felt like I had to go somewhere else to be able to thrive. C: So, but I'm totally connected. And that's why I have this Brazilian Student Association. I have weekly meetings. I organized weekly meetings for people to get together and speak Portuguese. And I always expect to see Brazilians there, you know? C: So it's a way to be connected to other Brazilians. And it's been successful because, you know, I always have the chance to make a good crowd, you know, every, every week. So yes, I've pretty much connected. C: And this is something interesting because a lot of people in Brazil, they are surprised when they talk to me after a long time they get there. They're still surprised that I have a strong that I still have my strong local accent from my hometown because they expect me to meet other resilience. C: With time. I would lose my accent, but I don't, I haven't. I still have this strong local accident from my hometown and I make sure I keep it, you know, I really want to preserve it. This is my–part of my identity. J: And I know we touched on this with the other previous things we've talked about. But what would you say about maybe the Brazilian community within Lawrence, like greater Lawrence outside the University of Kansas. J: Is there, would you say, a Brazilian community? Or, how– how would you define it? C: I would say Brazilian community. Yes, we do have a very tiny Brazilian community in Lawrence. We have I don't know how I don't actually know how many Brazilian students are at KU. C: But I know of 30 students. 30 students, which is not a lot. But yeah, we have this very small community. But I know that in Overland Park, Olathe, in these towns surrounding Kansas City, there are more Brazilians. C: There is this Brazilian Academy, which is a studio where they offer [indistinguishable]. So lessons–Cappoeira lessons, Brazilian dance in different music styles. Dance classes. C: So there are many Brazilians who live in the area. So yeah, we do have a community and presented community here, but really tiny comparatively. If you compare it to Miami or Boston. C: Boston has the largest amount of Brazilian immigrants in the country. So it is pretty tiny, but just sad, like I wish there were more. J: And, you mentioned how you were able to bond with the other Africans and African Americans in Miami. And so I was wondering, were you able to form other bonds that were similar across cultures, across identities within Lawrence as well? C: Yes, because actually, this is what my department–actually my department, there are people from–this is what I've heard. Like in the department of Spanish and Portuguese. They're our best students for several countries, even from the, even from the United States. C: You know, like because there are so many people from so many different countries. So here the Department, Spanish and Portuguese will have, I have colleagues from Korea, Colombia, from Spain, Panama, the U.S., Uruguay, Argentina. Jewish Americans. Christians. C: So, yes. And outside of the department as well, I have friends from the Middle East, from Asia. East Asia, from–from Eastern Europe, Russia. So yeah, I really like the fact that I have so many friends from so many different countries. C: But unfortunately, I don't know many African-Americans here. I don't think there are as many. But yeah. J: Thank you for that comparison. This is, I guess, the final question and sort of a wrap-up question. J: Wth you–since you've had all these exciting experiences, I'm doing the Capoeira and also living in Miami and then Salvador, going back to Salvador, Brazil. And now you're here in Lawrence. Do you have any advice or wisdom that you would like to let the younger generation know or just other individuals? C: Yeah, actually, this is what I tell everybody. There isn't a perfect place to live. There isn't a place of dreams. I don't think you will find happiness in a place; it is not the place itself that will make you happy, but the circumstances you– C: That's what I told my friends in Brazil. That they can be really happy where they are. But they can be really unhappy where they are. C: If they come to the U.S. they can be really happy, but they can be really unhappy. It will depend on their legal status, will depend on the city where they're going to live, on the opportunities that they will have. C: So it will depend. C: I know Brazilians that are miserable in the U.S.; I know Brazilians who don't want to leave this country. I know Brazilians who are indifferent. They are okay. They will be fine with any work: with whatever, you know. C: And I know Brazilians who are really happy because they have good jobs, have stability and I know Brazilians who are unhappy because they have no perspectives, they have no–they are poor. They live in a very violent zone; it will depend. C: So what I would tell this generation is don't try to escape, try to live abroad as a way to escape from–as a way of escaping from your sadness or whatever. You know, I don't think another place will necessarily make you happier. It will depend. There is no formula. This is what I tell everybody. C: I actually, I, yesterday I gave a speech to this group of fifth grade students in Brazil. And I told them this, you know, that a person can be really happy in Brazil because we have all their things, for example, I don't have my family here [in Kansas]. I miss my family. C: But I have stability. I have safety. I feel really safe here. I don't have to be afraid of robbers, because Brazil can be really violent. So there are pros and cons. C: So there is a Brazilian, there was a Brazilian singer. I don't know if that's..if he’s the author of this. But he would say that living in Brazil is good, but it sucks. Living abroad sucks, but it's good. I think that it was Tom Jobin. I might look it up eventually. C: So this is what I would say. You know, there is no secret formula. Each experience is unique. There are happy and unhappy experiences, good and bad experiences. This is what I would say. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Caio Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Salvador, Brazil to Lawrence, Kansas Description An account of the resource Living in Lawrence, KS at the time of this interview, Caio is a student from Salvador, Brazil. He first arrived in the United States to teach Portuguese in Florida where he remembers being able to connect to a diverse group of individuals because he grew up with a region that is racially and culturally diverse. Caio briefly went back to Brazil before arriving in Lawrence, KS. He is enthusiastic about sharing Brazilian culture with the community and is the president of the Capoeira Club, a member of BRASA, the Brazilian Students Association, has led Brazilian dance lessons and was part of the Lawrence Public Library’s Cuentacuentos and Multicultural Storytime. His advice for the younger generation is to focus on doing the best you can within your circumstances. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2010s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Lawrence, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_gxmh9bhb" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_gxmh9bhb/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland Caio Interview"></iframe> Brazil Community Education Identity Lawrence Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Joohye Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Diana Location The location of the interview Lawrence, Kansas Language of Interview English City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Bogota, Colombia Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Lawrence, Kansas Intermediate point in journey (1) City/State or Country to which interviewee (or parents/grandparents) traveled before coming to current point of residence Lansing, Michigan Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Diana (D) Joohye (J) D: So we lived there from, oh my God, 2008 until 2012. D: Then we went back to Colombia because my husband had a Fulbright. So we needed to went back. So we were in Colombia for five years. And after that, he decided that he wanted to apply to jobs here in the United States. And I was agreed. D: So first we came here to Lawrence, Kansas for one semester because he was a visiting professor. D: We came here in August 2015 until December the same year. At the end of that period, KU offered him a job. So we went back to Colombia for one year to get ready and have papers and everything. D: And we came for good at the beginning of 2017. D: And he start work as a professor here in KU in the Communication [Studies] Department. And six months later I start here in Spanish and Portuguese Department as a lecturer. That was the beginning. J: Could you explain a little bit more in detail about your first experiences when you talked about your first arrived in Michigan? I bet that it was, there are some things that maybe were shocking or maybe some things that are similar. Maybe there's some things that were like “wow.” Could you explain in detail a little bit more? D: Yeah, of course. D: During that time we didn't have kids. So it was a totally different experience. I didn't speak very good English–I'm still working on that–but during that time my English was very…it wasn't enough. So that was difficult for me. D: But I started studying English every day. And that was incredible [and] helpful because I was immersed in the culture. So I had to speak English every day. So my English improved very fast. D: We really like Michigan. We were–we lived like a student, so it was different. [It was a lifestyle] with a small budget and we had a good group of friends. They're from different parts of Latin America. So our experience there was more like a student here, I think so. D: We–we found that Michigan State was a really diversity [sic] campus. It was–there were people from every part of the world. D: So there was something very different for me because I used to live in Bogota, that is a big city. But there are not a lot of people from other countries. So that was different. D: And what else? And before that, I worked a lot in Bogata. I did my masters, so I was always busy. Then in Michigan, I studied English in the mornings and then I was free. So I had a lot of time in my hands and that was totally different from my life before Michigan. D: And I start to do different things, travel a little bit inside this–Michigan and make friends and to craft and that kind of stuff. D: And of course, we need some food. Because Michigan has, we lived in East Lansing, that is next to Lansing. And we found in Lansing some Latin American markets. So we were able to find some Latin American food there. D: And also in Asian markets, we found some Latin American food or at least food that was similar to our foods. So that was great. D: And I had a lot of time to read. That's something that I love. D: That was like at the beginning and we really fell in love with Michigan. It’s a great, great part of this country. J: Would you also say that there was a strong Latin American community in Michigan? Or how would you describe what or was it mostly like being in University you're talking about because they are university students or was there also presence in the community? D: I'm not sure about the community–the Latin American community in Michigan–MSU had–during that time I'm not sure if there is still have that–they have Latin American group with the students and also professor[s] and staff. D: So when we go there, the Latin American group contact us and they gave us like a basket. With some gifts, some stuff that we were going to use and need, like, for example, pots, and also silverware, blankets. That [type] of stuff. D: That was really amazing because we felt welcomed. D: And immediately we start to to get together with them. They had different activities during the year, like a Halloween or Thanksgiving. Some parties to–to people–people be able to talk and meet. D: So that's why we were able to have a good group of friends from Latin America. We were in the same situation. We were students, or actually we also had some professor that became friends and we had a good group there. J: Would you also like to share, you mentioned that your husband received the Fulbright then you guys then you had the opportunity to go back to Colombia. Would you be able to discuss what that was like after some time in Michigan and then back to Colombia again? D: Yeah. It was very difficult. Because when–before we went back to Colombia, my first kid was born. He was born in Michigan when he was maybe two-months old, we went back. D: We had a totally different situation. We were new parents. We were tired. We were lost. And I think it was more difficult to went back to Colombia then to came to Michigan for the first time. D: It was more because when we came here, we knew that it was temporary. It was an adventure. But in Bogota, it was our real life. We were new parents. So it was difficult for my husband and for me; at the beginning, it was more difficult for me. D: But after, I don't know, maybe six months, seven months, I start to accept the situation, to get used [to it]. And my husband started to feel sad, nostalgic. Because also Bogota is a very big, crazy city. The traffic is terrible. It’s like a big city like New York, Chicago, I don't know. Many people. It is crowded. The transportation is crazy. Sometimes could be insecure [unsafe]. D: And Michigan…Lansing is a small town. Everything is easy. You get very fast to every part of the city. D: So that was like a shock. We knew that Bogata was like that. But we weren't aware that we were going to miss that much–the life that we had in Michigan. J: And then when you came back to Lawrence from that from the Fulbright and then to Lawrence. Would you also be able to describe more specifically that transition? D: Again to the first time when we came here as a visiting professor? J: Yes. D: Okay. I came here. We came here when my second child was two months old also. So that was tough for me. I wanted to came because I knew that it was a good opportunity for him [Diana’s husband]. He was absolutely sad about his job in Bogata. He really wanted to be able to research more and here is easier than in Columbia. D: I was–I wanted to support him and since I had maternity leave, because in Columbia you have paid maternity leave, we decided that it was a good time to came here. So we did. But it was very difficult. We live in an apartment that is part of the KU apartment from visiting professors small apartment, but it was enough. D: But I didn't know anyone. I was with a newborn. He cried a lot. My oldest boy didn't know how to speak English. So when he went to the daycare, he was miserable. He cried a lot. I was very sensitive. I think that hormone because of the postpartum. And my–and my husband was working like crazy because he felt that [he] got that one was an opportunity that he need to to take advantage of. D: I was–I was lonely, lost. I didn't know…It was difficult. I took advantage of be with my baby. But at some point, you need to talk with other adults. That was difficult for me. I don't have a good memories about that time. I like it. Lawernce. Because Lawrence is charming, but I didn't know anyone, so I don't know. J: Did you feel like after some time when you became a lecturer for the Spanish and Portuguese Department, you were able to start to feel more of the connections with other adults? D: Yes! Of course, because we were here as a visiting professor for one semester and then we went back to Colombia for one year. So that year was weird because we knew that we were going to came back again. And I knew that my life here, what's going to be different from the life that I had during those four months when we came here for the first time. D: So I was preparing myself and I knew that I was going to have a job and [a] different experience. D: So during the first six months when we came here for good. It was difficult because I miss my family. I wasn't sure about the day. That was the right decision for us, especially because of family and friends. D: But then I start to see that my husband was happy. My oldest kid start to learn English very fast, very easy. And my youngest one, at that point, was one year-and-a-half. So it was easier. And he start to–to–to go to the daycare as well. D: So I had more time for me and then I started to work. And, yes, that changed everything because I like to be active. I love to be with my family, but also I love to have my own life, my projects, my time. D: So it was good. D: That was a very good change of the dynamic for me. J: Would you be able to explain a little bit more when you said, “I like to have my own life.” Like some of them more in detail, like the projects or activities are the ways that we're able to do that? D: I love reading. I like to read and when you have a babies or kids it is very difficult to find the time to do it. Because at the end of the day, you're so tired that you just want to watch TV or I don't know…So for me it was very important. It is very important to have time, not just after they go to sleep. D: Just like I–in the middle of the day when I when I am awake to do certain stuff like a reading or meditate or just go to a coffee shop and work from there, or maybe have lunch with a friend. Or just watch my own shows, not just Paw Patrol and Peppa Pigs. Or a date with my husband or talk like a long time with my mom or one of my friends from Columbia. D: Or workout. I like to walk. I like to walk by myself sometimes with my family, but I prefer by myself. And it's not, not, not like as something very special, but it's important for me not just be a mom or a professor or a wife. It is more like I like to be able to do wherever I want during certain moments of the day or at least of the week. J: And also you start, you had the opportunity to start as a lecturer in the Spanish and Portuguese. Could you explain what it was first like lecturing and maybe preparing materials and teaching new classes of students and things? D: Okay. I had experience teaching at MSU so I was familiar with the college–I don’t know–contexts. Then in Columbia, I was a teacher in the middle school, so that was very different. D: So when–when I started to work here, I have, of course I was scared because I am an immigrant. That moment in the political context was very difficult in this country. This is still difficult, but at the time was when Trump start to be a president. So we were really scared of that. D: Even…I mean we were legal and everything, but still we didn't know how was going to be living here with that contexts, with that political situation. D: So when I started to work and found like a, maybe because I teach Spanish, usually. Students are more like open-mind. If you want to learn another language, it is because I think so, you know or understand that the world is more than the United States. D: So that was, that was a relief, like to see or to able to feel like the students were, like, nice, respectful, welcome people from different backgrounds. And this [KU’s Department of Spanish and Portuguese] Department of course has different people from different countries. So that was good. D: I did–I had to prepare material, but I had during that time a coordinator that he was very, very helpful and he was ready to help me, to explain me, to guide me. So I felt support. After, I don’t know, two months I was more comfortable. D: It was at the beginning, it was easy, I think so. I was a scared of course, but it was easy. And I felt like I was able to be myself as a teacher like my own mark or whatever. Yeah. J: And also you feel like before were there certain things which made it difficult for you? And you said you were able to be yourself when you started to teach. But before were there things that made it more difficult to be yourself or yourself at some times and not others? D: Can you reframe the question? J: That you are able to be myself as a teacher. And I was wondering with the like the students were open-minded and respectful. Were there other factors that allowed you to be more into yourself in your teaching? D: Okay. Yes, I think so. I had a supervisor but he never tried to [im]pose his view. He was very open to hear my ideas. Very respectful with my methods. I felt like I was able to propose different things to decide. We had to follow some–some maybe no activity, some topics. D: But I was able to decide if I wanted to explain certain topic the more deep or not or, like, I was able to read, my students, took decisions and my supervisor was very respectful with that, and I really appreciate that. That's why I felt like I was able to be myself. D: I had to follow certain stuff, but it didn't feel like I was repeating something that other person did. J: Okay. And this is sort of going back to one of the first things you talked about finding certain particular ingredients in some Latin American markets and also as Asian, Asian, some Asian markets. And I was wondering, is food, your primary way of staying connected with the Colombian culture or reminding you of Bogota? J: Or is it also, do you think there's like a linguistic aspect because you also teach Spanish, so the food and the language. J: And are there also other customs that you practice or that you hope that your family will continue? D: Food is important, of course, I am not the one who cooks at home, it is my husband. I don't like to cook. So he tried to cook a Colombian food. And some of the food that he cooks need like a very common ingredients. D: But of course, I need some food that I can find here. So sometimes–my brother lives in Florida–and there is very easy to find food from Columbia. So sometimes he sends a box with some food that I like it. D: When my mom comes, she also brings some treats on some of the stuff that I like it. So…but it's important, but it's not like essential for me. I'm not crazy about food. It's like not something that I think about it the whole time. But we eat a lot of Colombian food. I mean, the–the dish that my husband prepare, usually are Colombian food D: But other other things that connect with my country, obviously the language. We just speak Spanish at home because we really think that it's important that our kids keep their language. Every year is more difficult of course, because they are growing up and they want to talk English the whole time. And we're really, really, what is the word for that…are really determinate that have to speak Spanish because my mom doesn't speak Spanish. D: My mother-in-law does sorry, English. My mother-in-law doesn't speak English. And also because as a person that learned English when I was an adult, I know how difficult it is. D: I have and I had and I have some students that their parents were from Latin America or something like that and they didn't speak Spanish with them. And now they are learning. They are like, I don't know, understand why my parents never talked to me in Spanish. That is very important. The idioms. The way that we say some stuff. D: My mom comes very, very often. My mother-in-law, too. So that is important for–to keep the contact with our family and our friends. D: And also some traditions. I didn't know. Nothing special but e.g. in December. The seventh of December, in Colombia, that is the day that Christmas starts, like, officially, and you just light on some candles outside your home to celebrate Día de la Virgen [CHECK] Virgin Mary, Virgin Day, something like that. We still do that. It's hard because it's cold here during the day. But we tried to keep doing that. D: And–I don't know–the way that we are trying to to raise our kids. They are kids–they're growing up in a different culture that we did. So we try to to meet so to either know both cultures and that is tough. I mean, I think he's going to be great for them, but sometimes as parents it is hard. J: And are there any other details or examples that you would like to share about your story, your experience before I ask you a final wrap-up question? D: About my traditions? Or about what? J: Just in general about your story so far. D: Okay. Let's see. I don't know. I mean, we have lived here for almost five years. Almost five years. We're happy here. But I think that we never going not to feel as an immigrant. So this is our home now, but you are an immigrant. And I think that we need to make peace with that. Be proud of that. D: We feel, like, privileged because Lawrence in general is a safe open space that welcomes immigrants. But of course, there is always something in the back of your brain that knows that maybe, in some point, maybe there is going to be a person who say something awful in a store, for example when you are talking Spanish with your kids or I don't know. D: For example, when I go to a store and the person is not very polite, I try to think that that person is having a bad day or maybe is that the way that person is? I'm not trying to think immediately that that person is racist because otherwise it's going to be very difficult if you're always are defensive about everything. D: But it's a possibility. And obviously, I'm scared that especially for my kids because they are–they feel like they are Americans but they don't–they don't. And of course sometimes they ask why we don't do certain stuff and my friends do. Why is your pronunciation like that? They try to obviously correct my pronunciation…the whole time. D: Now they understand more that [my accent] is part of me, is part of my English and that it is brave for people who tried to speak another language. And that is totally okay. It's okay to have an accent, wrong pronunciation. D: So we're trying to educate them to see that everyone has the same rights, that they have to be proud of their culture, and that there is no issue to have two different backgrounds. But they realize that it's not easy, but we're trying. J: Actually, you answered my wrap-up question… D: Okay! [laughs]. J: Which the question was: If you had any advice for your children or just like the future generation in general, what would it be? And wow, thank you. D: You're welcome. D: I think that is important–I really like, for example, to read books to my kids from different authors, from different…with different news stories to explain. Maybe fiction, but explain that kind of situation. D: And we try to be very honest with them. These 0s, maybe he's going to, Maybe it is going to happen. You have to be ready. But at the same time, we had been lucky because we have a good group of friends here. We haven't felt anything bad so far. Maybe not very explicit. Maybe some people don't like us, I don't know, but we haven't felt. So yes. D: So my idea is that my kids don't feel bad because they don't have parents who speak perfect English and they accept other cultures. So they–they are in a good elementary school where they have more classmates from different parts of the world. So that is good. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Diana Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Bogota, Colombia to Lawrence, Kansas Description An account of the resource Originally from Colombia, Diana has lived in Lawrence, KS for a number of years. In this interview, she speaks about her experience before moving to Kansas, when she first lived in the welcoming city of Lansing, Michigan. She found Lansing to be “totally different” from Bogota. After staying in Lansing, she went back to Colombia before arriving in Lawrence, Kansas. Diana emphasizes the importance of staying connected to Colombian culture through language. Her message to the younger generation is to respect others. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2010s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Lawrence, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_c8osuzon" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_c8osuzon/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Diana Heartland Interview Trimmed"></iframe> Colombia Community Education Language Lawrence Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Marta Caminero-Santangelo Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Gina Format Video, audio only, text only Audio City (Region, State) and Country of Origin for 2nd and 3rd generation, this is the place of family's origin Guerrero, Mexico Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Lawrence, Kansas Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Gina Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Guerrero, Mexico to Lawrence, Kansas Description An account of the resource Gina is an indigenous woman from a rural town in Guerrero, Mexico. She speaks of her childhood which was when she realized that her family’s resources were very limited. Gina arrived in Lawrence, Kansas with hopes of continuing her education but found herself with a younger daughter to care for. She says that she has chosen to stay in Lawrence with her family because it protects her in a way other cities in other states would not. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2000s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Lawrence, Kansas Identity Language Lawrence Mexico Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Marta Caminero-Santangelo Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jesse Language of Interview English Format Video, audio only, text only Video Current City of Residence Where in Kansas or Missouri the Interviewee currently lives Kansas City, Kansas Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Jesse (J) Marta (M) J: Okay. Well, let's see. My mother's side of the family is my grandfather…Her dad was already living here in the United States. He had came [sic] from New Mexico. He would actually because my grandfather was very dark-skinned. I've had a lot of Indian in him. He was an extra in silent movies as an Indian back into movies that before they were talking. They were the silent movies. J: He came up with a friend, Robinson, to Kansas City, Kansas for more work. And he found work with Griffin Wheel Company and that’s the company that makes railroad wheels and boxcars. J: And he had a home in Argentine, on the what's considered the south side of the tracks. And at that time, it was all Anglos on that side. And my grandfather was the first Latino to own a house on the south side of the railroad track and never did get the full story on that, how that happened. J: [Coughs] But anyway, again, I'm sure Alice Robinson is one that helped him with that. J: Then my great uncle Salvador came up from Mexico as a young man. He swam the [Rio Grande] river, he made his way to Kansas City, found a job with the Santa Fe Railroad as a painter and met my grandfather somehow or another, and lived with my grandfather for two years. J: After two years he returned to Mexico to return was my grandmother's Brunelda, my great uncle Leo and my great grandmother Paula. And so they came to live in that house. J: And the story goes from my uncles that because Grandpa Rico, who was 33 at a time allowed Salvador to live there said, you can marry my sister, who was at that time only 15 years old. J: So they had their first child, Uncle John, when she was 16. Mother came along four years later. Uncle Bob came along four years later. And Martin came for your later. Uncle Joe came four years later and uncle Frank came three years later. J: My uncle contended that my grandmother would only let him [the grandfather] sleep with her once every four years. M: [chuckles] J: So that’s the way the story goes. J: The house they lived in had a living room, two bedrooms, a bath, and a kitchen. So all the men slept in one room and all the women slept in another room. J: My grandfather also at this time, besides working at Griffin Wheel, was the neighborhood plumber. So him [sic] and his friend Chenel, who lived across the street–and by the way, I'm gonna get a hold of Chennel’s great granddaughter and we're going to be able to contact with her. Her name is Bea Madrigal. But that's a little later. J: Anyway, grandfather was also a bootlegger, which my uncle said led to his death when he died of cirrhosis of the liver. J: Grandpa Rico died the day they landed on the moon in 1969. So it’s always an easy date to remember when he passed. J: But anyway, getting back to the thirties, in the late thirties and early forties, my mother tells the story of grandpa being a bootlegger at Christmas time. They had men–Coop Doors [?] came by and they would sing songs and carols. J: And so my grandmother always told grandpa, take the boys out a bottle of gin. I don't know what it was. They may have been anyway. Excuse me. J: They took the bottle out and was passing it around, somebody slipped and dropped the bottle. It broke and all and there was snow on the ground. J: She said All these men were on the ground, eating the yellow snow, where the booze had fallen into. J: So that being said, that was just one story about grandpa and what he did, he was very industrious. J: My grandmother was very active in the church. But the only time I saw Grandpa go to church was for somebody's funeral or for a wedding. Otherwise, Grandpa didn't go to church. Never to get the full story on that. So a lot of times things happened and we weren't always keen to what was going on. J: Fast-forward to 1947. My mother is 17 year old girl. My father came up from Mexico on a borrowed passport. Somebody that you'd looked very familiar with. J: Dad was actually in the seminary at this time, and was studying to be a priest. He was the 13th child out of 13. And my grandmother said one of her son was going to be a priest. And because he was the last one, he got elected to the job. J: Well, he came up on a vacation, met my mother, and their dating story begins with him living next door in a boarding house. And because my grandmother was very strict, [my father] was not allowed to talk to my mother. So in order to communicate with her, he wrote to her own penny postcards. J: The mailman, after a couple of months of this and seeing how he would pick up a postcard from one house to take to the post office to get that back to the house. Next door decided that he would just hand the card over without having my dad having to put the penny on. J: So once in a while they could talk across the fence when grandma was sitting up in the patio and what and so then dad went over to ask grandpa for mom’s hand and my grandfather told him You have to go back to Mexico and you have to come back with your proper papers. J: He did not want her. How should I say? And I guess he wanted to protect her. J: So my dad goes back to Mexico, quits the seminary. And I'm sure that went over real well with my grandparents [sarcastically]. J: But anyhow, he came back to [the] United States, courted my mother for two more years. J: And then this time dad always told me when he went to take mother out on a date–grandma always went, he had to take two boxes of candy or two bouquets of flowers for grandma and my mother. J: There was one time a few weeks before the wedding, dad and the taxi hip pulled up to take them. They were going dancing at the Pla-Mor Ballroom. And my grandmother was sick and came to the door and told grandpa, my toe, my dad, you cannot you cannot go because I'm sick. J: And my grandfather said no, it's okay. Let her go. So that was the first day they had unchaperoned and it was right before they're married. But grandma Rooney, raise, holy hell. J: Then back forward again because of the way my grandmother came back across to the United States, they decided that my dad would, my mother were [sic] gonna get married in Mexico. My grandmother did not go. My grandfather did not go. J: There was a lady down the street, Luis Valdez, and she was kind of like a sponsor. And so she was [my] mother’s chaperone. And so they went to Mexico, they got married and returned home. They were married June 15th; nine months and two days later my sister was born on March the 17th. My sister always teased mom about how close that was, but mother would be embarrassed. J: So that was March 1950. I came along in May of ’51. My sister Suzy came along in December of ’52. And then my sister Christie was August of ’54. J: So within five years she [my mom] had four little ones. J: Mother was a stay at home mom. She did not go–she did not work or anything. J: At that time my dad worked two jobs. He worked at the Ag. [agriculture] plant during the summertime and they would lay him off usually right after Thanksgiving until sometime in February. So he had two three months during the year where he worked one job. And the other jobs were with the railroad; he worked for the Kansas City terminal for 17 years. J: Fast-forward to 1967 and Johnson–President Johnson cut the mail off of the train and put ’em on the airplane. And that's when air mail with it. And that pretty much broke the Kansas City terminal’s back. So dad got laid off and he got laid off. J: Mother–they decided mother was going to work. Mother had a highschool education. J: We [my mother and I] went to the same high school, Argentine that Tess [?] was talking about. J: My mother was 36 years-old. She walked up the half a block up to the main street to get on the bus. And she was scared to death because this was the first time she was going downtown alone. J: Any other time she go in downtown if my mother was with her my aunt or us kids. And so now she had to work and get out in the real-world. And so she went to work for the SOC Security Administration. J: In the meantime, dad got a job with the Santa Fe Railroad. Then mother worked in the daytime, dad worked at night. And that way there was always somebody home with the kids because by this time there were six of us in the house. My older sister would have been. 17 and a junior. I was a sophomore, 16 and then going down the list. J: So that was a–I know a changing time in the whole world at this time, women were getting to be more independent and not to where your job is at home with the kids. You don't need to be out and whatnot. J: So I know mom and dad struggled with some of that because one's mother went to work and seeing how other people lived. And how women got to do things on their own, so on and so forth. Where they've got to be a little bit of a cultural battle. J: Not only were we growing up, but my parents were growing up at this time. This had to be something that was most unusual. J: Then it was about this time that Tess and I were walking home from school. And I told you the rain story where it rained and my house was close [by]. So we said let's go inside. Well, let's get on the porch and not even inside the house. Just on the porch. You get out of the weather. J: And my dad came out and asked if she was hungry because that was the way my folks were all their lives. Even after they retired, I would come over to the house and the first thing they're doing is reaching for a pan to put on the stove to heat something up. And I said, I didn’t come over to eat, I came over to visit. J: But anyway, Tess came over and she was a quote, unquote, first white woman, white girl that ever came into the house. So that was a little bit of a culture shock for me, I guess. J: I mean, we were pretty well–I don't want to use the word segregated but I think we were just–our community was separate from everybody else. Everybody else had a separate community. J: In the time that we lived on 24th street, when I was much younger, in kindergarten, at the other end of the block with an all-black school called Lincoln grade school. J: The black people lived up on the hill about three blocks from the school. And they walked by our half every day to school and walked home every day. Never had any issues with them. We had a black lady living next door with her son and I didn't think anything of it. J: You know, it would just they would–just people living like we were. J: We had a fireman–he lived on the end of the block and he was a black man. And then on the other side we had two other Mexican families that lived... J: So we were just people. J: We didn't didn't know anything. I didn't know anything about segregation. I had not witnessed anything. J: I do have some friends that were my age. And they told me that they had gone to a drugstore to get a soda. A soda from the soda fountain. And the guy says, I'll fix it for you, but it'll be in a cup and you will have to take it outside to go. Meaning [that[ they could not sit at the counter and drink [the soda]. J: I did not get exposed to any of that; I guess I was–was blessed in that. J: About this time I got out in the world of work and I went to work at the Kansas City Star and I worked on the weekends at nights, stuffing newspapers. J: On, on Saturday night, they would print the front page, the wanteds, the sports, and the classified. Everything else was all printed ahead of time. So you would always have to put the two sections, the paper together. J: Working there, I was exposed to a lot more diverse group. There were probably 60% black there, 30% Hispanic, and about 20% white. J: And this was, I worked in the period there in 1968 after Martin Luther King had got assassinated. And they were having the riots all over. Our job normally work from ten at night to five in the morning, but because of the curfew, we had to be there at 06:00 and sit in a warehouse and wait five hour, we go to work–work. And then after the curfew after the work basket or warehouse, wait till 06:00 because we couldn't be out 6-6. J: All the brothers–and this is what we used to refer to when we were growing up. When we talked about the brothers, we were talking about Black people. We never said we never used the term Black. J: Then back in high school, if you were talking about Ivan or Melvin, the Black friends, you were talking about the brothers. J: Amen. The brothers told us, when we go home, the hang white sheet on your front porch and nothing will happen to your house. Because this was a time when they were burning houses and they were riding over density very, we're very fortunate that in Kansas City, Kansas nothing happened. J: When I hung a white sheet on the front porch coming home. Mom said, What are you doing? The brothers said if we don't want to have our house burned down, hang up a white sheet, and they know that you would be okay here though she let it go because you don't make something up like that. J: So that means I'm sad. I was over there. And during this thing, it was the first time that I heard somebody knew the N word. And even to this day, I cannot understand how they can sing songs and use the “n” word to me that just sets the hair on the back of my neck. That's an alarm. J: I heard somebody used “n” word and I saw this guy got beat within an inch of his life. I've never seen anyone beat like that and I hope I never see it beating like that again. J: The guy came back to work two weeks later you've been attained with bandage up, but he came back to work and I don't think he used the “n” word again. I think he learned his lesson. J: So that was 1968, and I graduated high school in 1969. I started dating a girl that year, she was two years younger than I was, and she was a white girl. Her name was Lorraine Perkins. Ended up being my first wife. J: But the first time I went over to pick her up, her mother said I couldn't see her daughter. So we did not go out at night. So we figured out the next week when it was time to go out for the football game and the mixer afterward. I would have one of my friends, either Kelly or Chris, call Lorraine and say, Are you ready to go? And they would pick her up, drive to block. She would get out of one car and get my car and off we go. J: My wife was a change of life baby. Her mother was very old at this time. You would probably I want to say Oh, she was in her 60s. I'm 69. I'm not old, okay. So anyway, that's how we dated for a couple of years until she graduated high school. We got married in 1972. We had two children, and we divorced in 1983 because we got married too young. Okay. J: I know a lot of the issues, a lot of time to see my I felt insecure when she'd go over to the house and they would start talking in Spanish. And she would always think they're talking about me. She would ask me later on. Were they talking about me? No. They're just more comfortable speaking in Spanish about some things. J: And I told her when we were younger a lot of times that they didn't want us to know what they were talking about. They would speak in Spanish because I was a boy. I was out in the street. My sisters were at home, so they learned the language before I did. J: I also had a hearing issue growing up. I had to wear a hearing aid for a while and I learned to read lips. J: The girls in high school told me at the first [high school] reunion and they said, you know, oh, I always liked talking to you because you always look at me in the face and not be staring at my breasts. And I had to explain to them. Well, I kinda peeked every now and then, but I had to look at you–at your eye [sic] because I was reading your lips or I would make sure to hear what you say. J: Now, you can go ahead and laugh, but it's true. And you know, you’re a boy, you’re a boy--you know had that hormone raging and everything J: So anyhow and also had a lot of the girls well, I won't say a lot. I had two, three different girls told [sic] me–and it was kinda weird because that first one they said–you know, I wanted to go out with you in high school, but my dad wouldn't allow it. But if I saw any discrimination, that's where it was. Okay. J: And I am on the pale side. I'm not really a dark Mexican like my friend Mario is my grandma. My sister's a little on the dark side. They always call her “the Laylita” because she was a dark one. My other sister would red hair and she was like I was on my dad's side, family. J: Even though my cousin Gracie explained to me that she went back to Mexico and started looking up the [family] tree and somewhere back up the line we had a great, great, great grandmother who was a Belgian landowner. They lived, they worked for the landowner. She said, one of our siblings is half Belgium, and then they just dropped down not filling but one of our great grandparents. J: But I don't know how much truth there, but she went back and she was able to find a paper on it. There’s that. J: See, what do I leave off? And then I married again. And well, actually this is the funny part. J: I dated my current wife for about three years and then we parted because we were both too headstrong for each other. Okay. We knew that it probably wouldn't work, so we went off and didn't see each other for ten years–twelve years. We both married somebody else. We both divorce–divorced that second person ran into each other again. My daughter Rachel happened and now 24 years later here we are still married. J: Though we are actively been together for almost 30 years with a break in there. So little irony in my story, but what goes around comes around. J: I went to work for the Santa Fe Railroad… J: Well, I went to junior college, like I said, right out of high school and that's when I did the Che Guevara thing and I was independent. J: I mean–I'm going to college. My first semester. I felt like my mind got opened up that I didn't see or I didn't listen in high school. J: There was…high school was high school and then you get to college and you get to these classes… J: I had a gentleman that taught American government. All he had was a desk, a microphone, and a pencil, and he would sit and lecture you for 45-minutes. And he would just start writing and you're hearing all these things. But I couldn't believe it. J: I had a psychology teacher who, she must have changed her name, because she had gotten married. Anne Brown, I believe her name when she showed us her arm with her number [Jesse points to his forearm]. She had been in Germany. She had been in one of the prison camps. J: Prison camp? What are you talking about? I don't know, nothing. So then you go and you research in the library and you read this stuff and we say all that was going on? J: Okay, so my favorite teacher was Henry Louis and he was a history teacher. He is passed now and I could not believe when he told me that the Civil War was not fought to free the slaves. J: He said no, the Civil War was not fought to free the slaves, they ended up getting freed. But the Civil War was fought because of money. You know, everything rolls down to the money. J: So anyhow, we got educated through there after a year-and-a-half looking at going to a four-year college. I was looking at being a high school history teacher and football and track coach. J: And then I started investigating to see how much money they made and how much money it [college] was going to cost–and this was before I got married to..and I thought there's no way swing it. J: There was not [sic] scholarships available like right now. Much easier to get to–to get help to go to college where there wasn't that much. J: I think if I would have put my foot down and really insisted on it, I probably could have done it but there was–I'd seen my guys, my buddies were already working at the railroad making good money. I mean, almost as much as the teacher was making at this time. J: I thought, How can I pass that up? J: You know, I shouldn't be at my–my folks still had four [children] living at home. I couldn't…and they were going to parochial school. So that was already costing [them] money. J: I was fortunate to go to parochial school until the sixth grade. And because of my hearing problem, I never did get along with enough [people] for whatever reason. J: I thought when I was real young boy, I was going to be a priest. I really wanted to be a priest. I don't know, maybe because my dad was lined up to be that way. I don't know, but then I got to be a teenager and the priesthood kind of slipped behind me. J: So anyhow, fast-forward, back to going to work for the Santa Fe [Railroad]. I started working at the clerk cleaning up box cars, checking numbers on the cars and the trains when they came in, I had to walk the track. J: And after one year, they…there was a separate department of the clerk’s department that was called the SFRD, the Santa Fe Refrigeration Department. They went to my boss and said, we need to hire someone and within the railroad… J: The first year that I worked, I was extra bored, you never knew what day you're going to work. You never knew how long you were going to work. Some of you had real good paychecks, some months you didn't. It depended on your work. J: Anyway, these guys were going to offer me a regular job with set days off. So my boss told them “hire this guy.” Well, they looked at me and my hair was about as long as yours was maybe a little bit longer [past the shoulder]. And the guy said, no, we don't want no hippie. So they hired two other people. Neither one of them worked out after a couple of months. So then they came back in that third guy again, he said, “Where’s your man? You want somebody to work and come to work there.” J: They finally hired me reluctantly. J: I ended up becoming a supervisor in that department, I had that job for 12 years until they've done away with it. Then after they've done away with that job, I had to go back to the clerical forces, for about two years and then I became a supervisor in the transportation department or rather the yardmaster. J: The yardmaster is the one that runs the yard. A couple of takes to make a train with which one separates them and whatnot. J: I was the second Latino yardmaster to work in Kansas City. J: At that time, they were looking–the railroad was looking to integrate departments. In other words, they wanted clerks to become the yardmasters; they wanted boiler men to become yard masters; they wanted foreman to become yardmasters. J: They wanted a cross-section because they figured if you know your part job already, you can and then you go to work the new job. You can see this part can help you. We can cut corners, changes. J: I won't say that I would breakin’ the line as far as becoming a supervisor in Kansas City because New Mexico, California, Texas, Arizona, they had Indians [Indigenous people] and Mexicans that were working as supervisors all over the place. J: The Santa Fe was very good about that [diversity efforts]. J: When I went to my first regional supervisor meetings and I looked and I see all my brothers, all the Latinos, Rodriguezes, Santanas, Camachos, and everything. What do you do? Well, you are? So am I. J: But we took pride in that and we did good. The Santa Fe was an excellent place to work. It got hard sometimes any job, but that gets far. Not easy. But for the most part, I was blessed to go to work there. J: In fact, to tell you how I got hired at the Santa Fe, I had been working at a steel plant and an ice plant, withdrew manual labor jobs. Okay. I had applications at the electric company, TWA, the gas company–four or five different places. I had applications. I've been waiting for the phone ring for them to come and get me the phone number rang, whether it because I had long hair like you. J: So then my dad says, “Come on, I'm going to take you to the railroad work.” J: I said I didn't wanna I didn't want to disappoint him. I thought to myself, okay. Let's go see what it's all about. J: We're walking up the steps to talk to the boss and held his hand and I said, Look, I'm only going to work here to give me a good job. Well, 40 years later I got my good job when I got to retire. So sometimes dad knows what's best for you. J: So I worked 40 years…My last ten years…Well, actually, the last 14 years was the BNSF [Railway company] and they also had a diversity department. And because my boss knew that I would be good with talking with people and whatnot. He thought that that would be a great department for me to go into. And that was working my regular job and having the goals, attending meetings. J: What we were was a link to get people to communicate with each other. J: One of the first issues that we came into was gender identity. This is 1996. Okay? We had, and I never did find out whether it was a fellow that turned into a gal, or a gal that turned into a fellow. But he was working in Amarillo. And the man did not want him in the men's restroom and the women and did not want him in the women's restroom. Okay. So then they had to create an extra bathroom that was for anyone to use. J: So you talk about an eye-opener situation like that. J: So [I] worked there. J: Then the other issue that we had, one that really dealt with me was the use of the word master. Because you had train masters, which is what I was, You had roadmasters. Who are the-the gentleman that took care of the track. And then you had master foremen who took care of the car department. J: So sometimes I think some of the employees were using that as a ploy to not work or to slow down production or whatever. But they were the word “master.” J: I always told him that I thought I went to master craftsman and not a master slave owner. You guys don't work for me, a slave, you guys are getting paid a very good salary. I don’t whip you, i don't beat you; I don't own you, you know, you go home from work every day lives. J: But it was hard to get across about being a master. And that's where some of the issues that are happening today is because of master-slave thing. So they never did throw out that term to my knowledge, I think there's still being used as train masters and yard master. J: Because that was a very that was a very important thing to be. My position. I am a year-and-a-half out of college and I'm working a supervisor job, but I'm one of the highest paid employees down there. J: I took pride in my job. I had–I had people that would come and work for me that had many years seniority and they could work someplace else and work in the daytime. But they chose to work with me afternoons and nights because they were comfortable with the way I did things. J: They knew what they had to do to get things done. And a lot [of] time I led by letting them lead. I let them show me. You got a better way to do this. Tell me I'm all ears. And so they would explain how to make a movie and I say go for it until I got a lot of respect for the truth that way. J: So I don’t think that I was ever one that they said, Oh, you got to work for that guy because we had those guys/ Oh you are going to go work over here for this guy. But when they would find out I would work and they say, Okay, we're going to have a good day. Suggests, is that fair? J: So I guess that's about it. J: I've retired after that. J: I started working [in] food kitchens. I help out where I can with that. J: I've been awarded a volunteer of the year. I don't know if I told you this or not. I'm going to receive a monetary award and a plaque for everything that I've done. J: The monetary award I wanted to put into the food kitchen fund to help continue feeding people and they will not allow it to happen. They said because you are a volunteer, this is something for you. You buy your new computer, buy a set of tires, you buy a plane ticket, whatever you wanna do. J: Well, my favorite thing is to play golf, and I've never had a better set of clubs. But there you go. In the next couple of weeks I'm gonna get a brand new set of golf clubs and I told my wife, [this would] probably be my last set. She said, Yes, that's what you told me the last time or the time before or fifth time, it doesn't come out of my pocket. Okay. J: I do the food kitchen work and it involved–when the kitchen was open…it involved about 18 different volunteers doing a separate job. We would feed 350 to 500 people. They would get a–two slices of bread and butter. They would get some kind of a dessert–donut or whatnot. They would get a choice of a salad or coleslaw, or something like that. They would get a choice of kind of some kind of fruit–apple, orange or banana. Then they would get either green beans or corn. Usually some sopa. They really love when we make it right. Okay, and then they would have a main course. Sometimes it would be Sloppy Joes, sometimes it will be pulled pork. Once in a while, it would be chicken, and then they will have to drink and milk. J: So it takes a little while to get all that organized. And my skills at the railroad from being an organizer and being a planner and looking up two, three things ahead, help out with that. And it really doesn't take up a lot of time. J: A lot of people think, oh, you spent a lot of time doing it. After all, it’s one day a month and one day I had to pick up the fly from there and that was a couple of hours. Another day, I had to go shopping so it was three or four hours. And then the day we actually cook was two to three hours. Then the day that we serve was about a five-hour day. So all-in-all maybe 20 hours in a month to do this. J: But this year with the pandemic, we're blessed with an organization called Operation Barbecue. They barbecue–that is another thing that I do. I'm a judge for the American [unknown] Kansas City KCBS society for barbecue meats. So I know what good meat tastes like, good barbecue. I know what bad barbeque tastes like, too. Some of these people that think they could cook can not cook. J: But anyway, this Operation Barbecue Relief, they organized when they had the first hurricane a couple of years ago. And these were barbecue enthusiasts, getting donations from different places. And they would get donations from different places, cook the food and feed–feed the people that were at the disaster area. J: Okay. Well, good friend, Chris Hillier [?], who is probably a big part of this second part of my volunteer, and really all the kudos should go to him because he is such great help. Through him, we were able to get food from the Operation Barbecue Relief. And so on Friday, we were serving meals. We had–they would give us to meet and decides and the utensils, the pan to put them in. But we haven't organized and put them together. I already had food kitchen people who knew exactly what to do and we started passing out meals, about 150 meals for families of four. We did that for about six weeks. And then Operation Barbecue Relief, because they had no place to go and cook the food because of the pandemic, they had to end that program. J: And then a couple of three weeks later, Pete’s Garden, which is another organization that goes around. They get grants and they collect food from different venues that doesn't get eaten. Like the hotel might have a conference there and they'll feed food and then they got food in the kitchen that didn't serve because people don't eat as much now as they used to. They always have extra so then they [Pete’s Garden] would get that food so it doesn't go to waste. And it would come to us. And again, we would put together and we would pass that out. J: During this time, we had St. Michael's Parish in Leawood. And we had the Church of the Ascension in Overland Park because every Wednesday they were supplying groceries, the families of our parish because the kids were getting school lunches during the week, Mondays and Wednesdays, they would get a lunch and a breakfast and so on. J: When we were getting the groceries, we would sort them out because some people would give you two cases of green beans and other people would be– somebody would give you eight loaves of bread. But we would have to break down the groceries. We make them be like shopping. There we go. And so we were passed from that out. And that lasted for about six weeks. We were doing that every Wednesday. J: Then. When that [unknown] quit, then Chris Pound, Catholic charity and through their program, we were able to give away boxes of produce every Friday–just ended last Friday. I don't know what I'm gonna do this Friday because I'm not going to be there. But these boxes of produce had cucumbers, had cabbage, had lettuce, had bags of apples, bags of oranges, celery, strawberries, cantaloupe. J: And so we were passing those out to the parish and because we had more than enough for the parish, we opened it up to the community, the Argentine community. J: I had two Facebook pages that I would put on there and I would say, come and get free food. No questions asked. The people would call and say, well, you know, I got a job. I said we're not asking any questions. If you want the food, you need the food and it's gonna go to good use, you come and get it.We're going to get it for somebody else. It's not for you. Come and get us. J: We wanted–we wanted to see what helped people and that's what we did. J: So through all that–through all that…that's how all this happened during the summer. I don't know that they give you the numbers on what we'd done. But it's the law and what somebody is not around it, it can be overwhelming. But to me, it was just another day in paradise J: Alright, so that's where I'm at today. I continue to do the soup food kitchen. We are in the process and now we have to make sack lunches because the kitchen is actually closed. The city allows us to hand out fact lunches out the back door. And because of this situation, they had jumped up. I think the most we have been is 862 packed lunches. We make about 800 sack lunches. And then any sandwiches or any apples or anything that would have leftover. We've taken back up to the school. We take back up to the food until they can use them tomorrow or the next day whenever it's needed. J: Hello…Still there? M: Yeah. I'm here. J: Okay, so I don't know if you have any… M: I have some questions. [To a male in the background of the screen: “Okay. Wait until I'm done, please. You can eat all that you want. Wait ‘till I’m done.] M: This is teenagers at home because they're not going to school. They're staying here for school. M: So, Jesse, did you live in Argentine, [Kansas City, Kansas], your whole life? J: Yes. I live while I move when I was married to my wife, I moved to Overland Park and I lived out there for about five years. And then I moved back to Argentina. And then two years ago, I moved to Lenexa. I sold my house. We downsized. We had a three-bedroom house, two car garage; it was just too big. J: And at that time I had not had what I had had my knee surgery but it would get too hard for me to maintain cut my flashing [unknown]anything. So we were just looking at downsize because we did not need that space. J: We put the house up for sale and sold like two days later. And the people next door and then combine it. The people across the street wanted at first, their loan didn't go through. We put the sign back out and the people next door came, bought it and they bought it. J: I don't know how many people were living. Next door. They had probably ten or 12 people living in a three-bedroom house. But when my house became available, they jumped all over it–two sisters bought it. J: I drove by a couple of times, a month or so later. My driveway could hold eight cars. There was eight cars in the driveway. I don't know how many people live in there. M: If I say the word home? What do you think of? What does the word mean to you? J: Home is where…My home is a parking lot. Vaguer [?] park. Oh, man, that home is the one that I told you about was Ted. I grew up there from the timeout 12 to 18 because over my formative years–that went home. That's where I live. M: Anything you would want for kids or other, you know, younger generation Latinos in particular, understand about your experience that maybe you think they don't understand right now? J: [coughs] No. I don't know if they understand how you have to work to get to where you want to be. What I've told you about my first job with the railroad. I was working from 3 o’clock in the afternoon to 11 o’clock at night. I had Tuesdays and Wednesdays off. J: Do you know how much [sic] social events I've missed? I'm talking about weddings. I'm talking about parties. Oh, we’re having a party Saturday. I'll be there after 11:00, you know, being the second way. Then you have to decide. They want a lot of people that I grew up with, they only went on to work eight to five was Saturday and Sundays off. No more hours. Well, those hours are not there. J: And I think it's even harder. Now with the way that education is that the pandemic has proven that by all these people working from home. I've got three blocks down the street–big office building before the pandemic that parking lot was always full. Now you drive by and you’re lucky to see a car there because all these people are doing their work from home now. You’ve got to have the education to do that. J: But there are good jobs out there. If you want to be a fireman, if you want to be a policeman, if you want to work for the telephone company, you want to work as a nurse, or anything in the hospital. You just think about it. Oh, I got sick at 4 o’clock in the morning. I'm going to the hospital. Look at those people [that] are working. They're working at nighttime. You have to understand that we're 24/7 mentality workplace. J: But then there was kinda hard it was hard, you know, my wife would be going to a party. Where’s your husband? Oh, well, my husband's working. So it was Tuesday, Wednesday nights when we went out. It was never crowded. We went to the movies. It was never crowded. You know, it hadn't advantages and disadvantages. You work those kind of hours. You can sleep when you want. J: I couldn't play any sports back then because everything happened on Saturday and Sunday until we found they were daylight things that we could play; we would get off work and then we could go and play ball at 9 o’clock in the morning. J: And then that's when I took up golf because that was something all you needed was a little sunshine to play that. J: So I would think that the hard–the hardest things for these kids, they have to understand everything and not an eight to four ob. Saturdays and Sundays off. J: I mean, that's the normal world. I can't tell you how many World Series games I missed. I was a big big pastime. Would listen to the radio, link them to buy a baseball, baseball game, World Series, football game, you know, whatever was everything radio, you had to visualize it in your mind because you couldn't see it on TV. Somebody say, oh man, we're going over to so and so's house. He could have put the TV up outside. We can drink beer and have hot dogs, you coming over? You know, they've just yeah. You [could] say I don't want to work. I'm gonna go–I'm gonna go probably why he going to pay your pay your bills? What do you do? You know? J: I want to get back to college. I want to get back and for nothing now just take more history classes, more. I can get into discussion, maybe some philosophy. Because you're older, you're wiser. You're not in a hurry for this class to get done. You can go do it. You gotta go through just the maturity thing and going to school. Just unbelievable. J: I mean, I know one kind of my brother-in-law and my sister were going through their differences and my nieces were asking me–and they were teenagers–they said, Uncle Jesse, yes, I can’t understand how a mom and dad are acting. I can't believe how things are and I told him, “Well, honey, you got to remember just because you get older, doesn't mean you grow up.” J: So it's something that I've always tried to remember. You know, the same thing which my boys would say, “Dad so and so team was supposed to and I said, yeah, just because you're supposed to win doesn't mean you're going to, well, there are disappointments in life that you have to deal with. There are situations that are not all hunky-dory. J: So it's just like what's going on right now. This thing in Louisville where the policeman got off killing a woman and everybody riding. Well, there's a way to explain your side of the story. I think without having to do the riots J: Maybe because I'm older, I'm thinking that so much hot blood is out there to try to make things happen your way. But it’s supposed to be that way–supposed to negotiate [coughs]. J: It’s supposed to be let’s share our thoughts. Just because you don't think the way I do doesn't mean I'm gonna I'm gonna, you're not gonna be my friends. J: It's so hard to see some of my friends on Facebook, how they feel about different things and all I can do is shake my hand. You know, that's a nice thing to do, is take your head. J: I've opened it with the death of Ruth [?] that a lot of people are gonna get out and vote. J: That's another thing that I do. I work the lesson. [chewing a crunchy snack] I've been a supervising judge in Wyandotte County for eight years. And then I've been supervising judge out here in Johnson County. J: Now what that means is I'm in charge of one polling thing. I answer all the questions, deal with everything that goes on in there. And we were very, very busy for the last primary. And I know that when the general election comes up in six weeks, that it's gonna be a very hectic day. J: I do hope that we don't have any issues. I'm very fortunate that I'm in a very affluent neighborhood in Johnson County. There are very few minorities but we do have them. There are no poor people [that] come to vote, okay? If anybody comes in rags it is because they choose to dress in rags. You know how the kids dress. Everyone that comes [to vote[ is very affluent. They're upper middle-class is how it is. Put it. And I'm sure that there are places even higher class and that in Johnson County. J: But I'm in western Shawnee and I don't have any poor people. I don't have any farmers. There are some places where you worked and Wyandotte County, we could see where people work in all of these people to come now, you can, you can, you know… J: One way of noticing is the ladies come in, they come and sign and they got rocks on your hand. And I'm not a jeweler, but I know that that’s not cheap, so they’re blessed. J: And so most people come and you're not going to argue with you about anything. They'll have a question. All my workers are excellent workers. Nobody looks at me like because I'm a Mexican or anything. J: There have been, in fact, where I'm at now–there was only maybe six people that I knew. When I worked at Wyandotte County and I worked at Argentine, I knew everybody that came in there. I had so many older ladies come up and give me a hug. I would give–the men would all come and say,they were so proud to see one of their [own] doing the work. Oh, Tucci–that’s my childhood nickname when somebody calls me Tucci, that means they know me from way back. Okay. Oh, tricky. J: And even now to this day, I probably had three phone calls from somebody in Wyandotte County asking questions about the voting. Do I need to vote now? Do I need to go? Somebody called and asked me about the primary and Kansas. Do I need to go vote in that? I said no, that's already been decided. You want to go vote? You can. And this lady was in her eighties. She wanted to know that you need to get out from there. I said “no, you're okay.” J: I don't mind helping out civic duty. I can't be a history teacher. I can still do my civic duty. So I help out. J: Very fortunate I got a great wife that's understanding that lets me go and do whatever I want to go do because she knows I'm helping people. J: My favorite thing that she says her sister was asking her. And I heard this on a speakerphone. Well, where’s Jesse at? “Oh, he's out feeding the world.” So that, you know what she's asked her what she considered when I'm doing what I do, my civic duty. So that makes me feel good that she knows that I'm doing that. I guess that's about it unless you have more questions. M: Well, Jesse, that's a really rich story. There's so much there's so much history in your story. You kind of are a history teacher. J: Yeah. Basically how I break things and break things down. It is by the history–thing that you can relate to it. I've talked about Martin Luther King, talked about landing on the moon. We've talked about Daegu where? So yeah, these are these are–things that are big impacts on my life. M: You can tell–you kinda mark your story by what was going on in the world and in the country. J: Now I have a lady. I can introduce you to her name is Bea Ramirez. Her maiden name is Madrigal. Her grandfather or her step grandfather, Channel [?] was my grandpa’s buddy. They lived across the street from each other and they were both plumbers. They were together like Mutt and Jeff [?]? J: So she is educated, she went to Pitt State and got her CPA. J: I will get a hold of her and I will send an email with her email and text. And then you guys can figure out how to get together and do this Zoom, call me. Let me tell you–Bea Ramirez can talk. M: I like, Okay. That's great. The more information the better. M: Hey, Jesse. So were you first-generation your family when you went to college? When you went to community college? J: Yes. I was a first first one to go to college. My brother…my sister went to work. My older sister, my two other sisters got married. And then my brother number four, he graduated from well, he went to KU..but he graduated Benedictine..He is the Fire Chief in Corpus Christi [Texas]. J: So, [he is called] Chief Rocha down there. So I go down there in January when the weather gets cold here, I go down there to play golf. Every time we go to the restaurant, Chief Rocha, I got your table over here. We would go someplace and there are ten people waiting to eat, they see him and say “Chief Rocha.” We'll walk around and everybody–kinda embarrassing at first. That way, It's pretty cool. He gets his recognition. M: Yeah. J: He likes that. J: And my younger brother went through Baker University and he worked for the city of Kansas City, Kansas he’s in procurement and left for another job. So– M: Did you ever wish that you grew up in Texas or California or something? Or were you happy growing up in Kansas? J: I grew up in a village. I had people–I had love all around me. I didn't I didn't see very much violence. Yeah. We had our fight as kids and whatnot. But there was always somebody there that you could depend on. I didn't see a lot of hatred–when we heard of our first divorce when I was about 12 or 13. Oh my God, that was sacrilegious, you know. J: We had a nun who was our teacher. And then she left the nunnery, came back three years later, married with the husband. But we all thought, holy cow, how in the world could she do that? J: And that's what mom explained that they are just people–even though they become priests or they become nuns–you still have to remember that they’re people. J: When I was married, my second wife, we had a pool at the house. And one of the priests, we had two priests at that time, one of the priests was just a year older and I would come over for a beer, right. I mean, ate steak and had beer. And then he said, “How about let's jump into the pool?” So all the kids jumped into the pool and they were jumping all over him and dunking him in the water and my then wife said–look what they’re doing to the priest! J: He's having fun. He's just a guy. J: You know, my dad still had friends with priests. Here's another little story. We went to Royal Stadium, not Royal’s Stadium [?], a municipal stadium, the 22nd of Brooklyn. This would have had to have been about 1958–59. We go to the ball game. My dad, friend, Father Paul, not wearing a collar. Okay. He's dressed in a regular shirt, and I thought, well, okay, but we get to the game and it's the first inning. And here comes the beer man. And my dad stopped the beer man and said “let me have two beers.” J: He gives the beer to my priest, a beer to my dad, I see the priest take a drink of beer…and I thought to myself, we're going to hell now. But that's how naive I was at that time. You know, you have your thoughts. It can't be no priest, the perfect, you know, then you find that they’re human. M: That's interesting. I've never actually thought about…Are priests allowed to drink alcohol? Well, the Catholic Church is against that. J: He did not get inebriated that I could tell. Okay. All right. We'll have to tell you that story. J: We did have a priest at our parish, he is deceased now, and he had an alcohol problem. J: I was on the school board because… because the age differences of my kids–two times, I had an eighth-grader graduate and then a kindergartener start the next year. Okay. Now, I was on school board for over 20 years. Okay. J: We had a school board meeting. Father King. He would smash smash, and we're trying to figure out what's going to happen with the school. The school didn't have enough money to run. We don't know if we're gonna be able to pay the teachers, if no one is doing [it] for us. So I told the head nun at that time, the principal, I said “we're going to have to call the archbishop.” Something's got to happen here. That was on a Tuesday. J: Well, the next thing you know is that weekend we had a different priest saying the mass. And everybody will want to know: “Where’s Father [King] at?” And then the word got out that he went to a rehab center. So they're human. J: And this priest was a great guy. He was probably in his late seventies and my mother always said he doesn't want to be working anymore; he’s working because we had a shortage. Okay. J: He went on to be afraid for another five or six years after he dried out [?]. Not at our parish, but at another place. J: So we're all just human. M: Yeah. Jessie, thank you so much. I really love your story. I'll send you the tape back…if there's anyone else so you can think of who you want to talk to me in the two years, that would be off. M: Or do you have a phone that you can take pictures of, letters and photos like that? J: Photos of what? M: Anything you have..pictures of your kids, your family? J: Well, yeah, I've got some pictures. You see me. J: You can see some of my pictures. One thing, when I look at my picture to myself, when I was young–I'm never smiling. I don't know if I was thinking, oh, if it was going, I couldn't hear somebody say “cheese” or whatever. But you will see a lot of my pictures. I'm not smiling as a youngster. J: I did not have a bad childhood. I did have issues with one uncle that was abusive to me and he's still my uncle. I'm not upset with them or anything, all that is gone in the past; I learned how to deal with my demon. You know, a lot of people [say that] they can not deal with my demons. J: I have another uncle who I got into a lot of this history from and he always contends that my grandmother didn't love him. Okay. I had to tell him grandma didn't love anybody but Frank, Frank was the baby. I said “so, don't worry about you not getting love from your mother.” Because grandma did not give– J: And you know, when people say, Oh, you love going over to grandma's house. M: [laughs] J: Well, if I loved going to grandma's house, it was because she had the TV. We had to go pay to watch Ed Sullivan because grandfather the ban on [unknown] you got to see who did the Beatles. J: The Beatles? Who wants to say anything about bugs? I say “Grandpa, no.” We gotta watch it. And I think we got to watch it because a little mouth [?] is going to be on top of video. So he said, Okay, let's watch the Beatles. I had to go over there to watch the Beatles. We didn't have our TV. J: Oh, you know, I was 13 or 14 when we got off work telephone and then polyline…Pick up the phone if somebody were talking to put the handle with a receiver and just listen to people's conversation. Then you hear..Is there somebody on the phone..Is this? J: Kids don’t know how easy they got it… M: It's true. My daughter calls me up from college. She says, “Hey mom, you want to FaceTime?” and we have a video call. Can you imagine? Even ten years old, years ago thinking, okay, I'll be talking to my daughter who's in college. Just like this, just like a Zoom call. J: I saw somebody that had a picture of a hand-held phone and they're holding it up like a regular camera [Jesse holds out his right hand like he is going to take a picture with a flip phone] and that's it. The first-out fees. Yeah. Yeah. J: Alright. I'll send you some pictures. I'll send you the Bea Madrigal information, and then you–we’ll keep in touch. M: Yes. Thank you so much, Jesse. I appreciate it. Have a great day and a great weekend. J: You too. Bye bye. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Jesse Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Mexico to Kansas City, Kansas. Description An account of the resource Jesse’s parents are from Mexico, but he grew up in the Argentine neighborhood of Kansas City, Kansas. After graduating from high school, Jesse enrolled in community college but decided to work for the railroad. Now that he is retired, he frequently volunteers in soup kitchens. His advice for the younger generation is to know the value of work. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Late 1900s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Kansas City, Kansas Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <iframe width="400" height="285" id="kmsembed-1_bfdgtl2w" src="https://mediahub.ku.edu/embed/secure/iframe/entryId/1_bfdgtl2w/uiConfId/45147491/st/0" class="kmsembed" allowfullscreen="allowfullscreen" webkitallowfullscreen="webkitallowfullscreen" mozallowfullscreen="mozallowfullscreen" allow="autoplay *; fullscreen *; encrypted-media *" referrerpolicy="no-referrer-when-downgrade" sandbox="allow-downloads allow-forms allow-same-origin allow-scripts allow-top-navigation allow-pointer-lock allow-popups allow-modals allow-orientation-lock allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox allow-presentation allow-top-navigation-by-user-activation" frameborder="0" title="Heartland Jesse"></iframe> Community Education Identity Kansas City Mexico Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Josef Subject The topic of the resource Oral history from Michocan, Mexico to Wichita, Kansas Description An account of the resource Josef was born in Michoacán, Mexico to a Mexican father and a mother with Spanish and indigenous heritage. He was married in St. John, Kansas. He worked on the railroad through sweltering summers and freezing winters. Josef received two degrees from Wichita State University and went on to become an educator and principal in the Wichita area. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Aron Muci Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource middle of the 1900s Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Wichita, Kansas Community Education Mexico Wichita